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Hi Rachelle! I personally adore your blog, and I tend to read a lot of other agents' blogs to stay current. Sometimes it IS a little confusing, but I think the confusion for me stems from what you said - there are so many different ways of doing things. Every agent is different when it comes to querying, every agent is different when it comes to things they like to see vs. things they don't. It's hard to keep everyone straight (in terms of preferences, etc.) but I think I'd rather have all the information out there, even if sometimes it gets tricky.

I've read some agent blogs out there that tend to be a little more callous than others. Miss Snark's blog, for instance, is lovely in terms of concise, clear information, but sometimes she would give us an unbreakable rule. I love unbreakable rules - until I go to another blog and hear someone else tell us that he or she wants us to break that same exact rule.

This is never something I would complain about because, like I said, I would rather have more information than not enough. But that's where the confusion comes from, IMHO.

Just found your blog the other day, I believe through Chip MacGregor's blog. I appreciate your candor and your writing style/voice. I think you're very clear. You also sound approachable, while also being professional. Thank you for sharing so much with us.

To answer your question today, I think you're basically right. It's a combination of information overload and the "give me a personalized answer right now and for free" thought that seems commonplace these days, fueled in part by our ability to Google answers instantaneously.

But I also think that it's part laziness. I suppose that ties into the "gimme" tendencies you alluded to. A lot of people want information served to them on a silver platter, rather than go to the book store, find the right books, read the books, and then process the information themselves. They'd rather be spoon fed because, hey, it's a lot easier! That I don't doubt, though I don't think it's healthy.

There is plenty of information out there—specific suggestions/instructions, as well as the caveat that this whole industry relies on gut instincts, and therefore is very subjective.

It's a matter of us writers taking 2 and another 2 and making 4 out of it. You, nor any other professional on that side of the table, can do that for us.

I think the amount of info is fine but I have found a general lack of consistency as to how to present our works from Query to synopsis and beyond. When we do what agent A asked us to do for Agent B we get ridiculed. My writing skill is far greater that a query or synopsis.I think it's sad when there are sites dedicated to being nasty about our attempts. I would never open myself up to that type of ridicule. I've opted for Indie publishing where I can be treated with the respect I deserve and have more control over my work. There is TOO much rudeness shown to the struggling artist. trying simply to get their work read.

Most information is helpful, but I could do with less of the writing critiques that agents offer on their blogs.

The critiques seem serious-minded and well-intentioned. Then I research an agent and look at their authors.

Here's an example, from a CBA bestseller's opening sentence:

"Like a butterfly breaking free from its confining cocoon, Tillie Reese emerged from the barren, tan-colored servants' hall into the opulence of Biltmore's main level."

More like a a cliche breaking free from a rejected writer's query.

In the first sentence.

I can't imagine how this survived the hatchets of the writer, the agent, the editors and the publisher.

And it makes me take less seriously writing critiques from agents.

Personally, I am very selective about what I read... too much is overkill. To be honest with you it depresses me a bit to see all the sites, blogs, forums and books out there, to help me. If I spend that much time reading and researching, I will never have time to actually WRITE!
I love your blog though, great information, thought triggers and a pretty smile :)
THANKS!

I read you and several others out of curiosity. I think I have learned there is no one right way to do this although there are definitely wrong ways - such as scented note paper and bribes of wine and chocolates. :-)
I may just end up writing something like, "Dear Agent, Please find enclosed the first three chapters of my novel."

As a published writer, I find that there is too much information available about certain aspects of the publishng business. I also get questions like, "What do I say in a query letter?" When that question comes up the best information I have to give, is what was given to me when I started serious writing, find a publisher within your genre, look at the writer guidelines for that publisher, and give the information they request. How you write the query letter I suggest the three paragraph style, Who I am, What I write and Why I am submitting to the specific publisher.
I also tell them not to despair over the rejections. I wall papered two rooms with rejection letters before I found one publisher that was willing to take me, a freshman writer into the fold of her business and see what I could produce and I'm still there.

Yep! Too many cooks spoil the broth. It's good to learn when and what to tune out - just takes practise

What's interesting is that the amount of information on the web has EXPLODED over the last two years. I remember searching for information back before I got my deal and finding it hard to come by. That all said, I think more people are writing b/c there's a recession on and why not pursue your longtime dreams? But also, I think what you might be experiencing is new waves of writers.

For example two years ago, I had a lot of questions about the business. But now, I just like reading about the business from agents and other writers' perspectives.

However, I'm sure there's plenty of new novelist to take my place in asking a lot of questions. Some of them will get deals or self-publish, some of them won't. Either way, in another year or so there will be another wave of writers asking lots of questions. And as your blog gets more popular, more and more of them will come to you.

Consider it a compliment, I say.

As for writers, I think a lot of becoming a capable writer is being able to hear a lot of information and being able to disregard the stuff you don't need and use the stuff you do. Either way, I don't think there's anything such as information overload. Just bad processing.

It is confusing and frustrating. I read a lot of blogs about how to format my MS, for instance. Then I used what I learned to make my MS as perfect as possible. When I sent some chapters to my crit group, they all pointed out things and said it was formatted wrong!

Rachelle,

There's a lot of desperation to be published. Try as you may, you'll never convince the unpublished writer that there isn't a magic formula SOMEWHERE, and if he says and does everything perfectly, then Presto! a book contract.

But since there actually isn't a magic formula, the Unpublished labors on, undeterred and unconvinced that it isn't just around the next turn of the maze.

And since he's myopically convinced there MUST be a magic formula, he becomes infuriated when everyone offers a different variation of what he's sure is really the magic formula in disguise. Because, darn it, how many magic formulas do you have to recite before you find one that works?

"Because it's not the book, it's not the book; I've written a perfect book, and why do you crazy editors and agents make this so hard? It's my life's dream; I need the money; everybody says I can do this; where's the **** formula; and why are you all crushing me?"

Dear souls... look for validation elsewhere. Look for your worth, and the worth of your dreams, in something more than publication. You won't find it here. Whether you publish or not. Fame of any kind is a chimera. Like the perfect magic formula that will see you published, you are chasing what you cannot, what you will not find through any human endeavor.

Persist, of course. But don't worship at an alter that will vanish in smoke at the moment you think you've touched it.

@ Ted

Watch out for crit groups. Some know what they're doing and some don't. This is the painful part: you have to be experienced AND confident enough with English language and publishing conventions to sift the useful from the not-so. That means reading widely, totally up opinions from different sources, evaluating them from your own experience, and comparing their credentials. And doing it again and again and again. In the end, you'll have to stand or fall by your own decisions.

Yeah, I know, it stinks.

Information overload is everywhere. We have to be selective based on our interests and exposure to various media. As one just delving into the business aspects of writing world I imagine much of the frustration is grounded in authors doubt and ignorance. People put a lot of work into writing, and they don't want to mess it up with something (seemingly) unrelated to the book. It's easy to press. Ultimately, queries-to-contract, I think it's still mostly (just) about good, interesting writing. I try to remind myself of that often and keep it simple. Really simple.

My lighthearted, novice understanding goes like this:

Queries show I know how to form complete sentences and generate interest.

Synopses (hope I can skip this one LOL) show I can write an active plot progression.

Literary fiction (in a query) means people who write better than I do until someone tells me my work is literary (or artistic, or boring).

Mainstream/Commercial fiction (in a query) means it appeals to almost everybody, but only after I become published and make it onto the shelf.

Writers are frustrated because they haven't allowed themselves to tap into - or to strengthen - that strong core that is able to distinguish the advice "out there" from the messages "in here" that give them creative direction.

Yours is one of my favorite blogs, because you gently reveal the major issues we need to think about, without tearing down what we've learned and determined as relevant to our work, our goals, so far. You boil things down to the essence. New writers sense this, which is why you're getting such an influx.

I say this even though I was crushed when you used my single-sentence summary as an example of what not to do a while back. ;-)

I agree with Ernessa: "I think a lot of becoming a capable writer is being able to hear a lot of information and being able to disregard the stuff you don't need and use the stuff you do."

Reading all the different blogs on how to query and such took the breath out of me. I sat down and wrote one, and then another, and then another, all differently written because of the different advices. I posted two on She Writes and asked which was better, and one said that it was as if I was describing a completely different story. One dark and serious while the other was up-beat and fun. It's really hard to guess which to use, because some agents would no doubt prefer the up-beat, while others would prefer the dark one. It's a gamble which to use on what agent. It would be easier if an agent could post a query letter that worked for them, but I suppose that's risky for an agent because they'd get all these perfect letters and it would be difficult to find the right manuscript to request.

There is a lot of information out there and most of it is not too contradictory.

But it's general advice. Any and every writer will want to know why their specific submission was rejected - that is the detail they want.

And that is practically never what they get.

There is a lot of information but I can't see that as a bad thing. It is impossible to read every word about publishing so I have had to filter through the sites to find the agents/authors/publishers that resonate with me. Just as no author can write the same thing, and no reader will have the same experience, no publisher or agent will work the same way. Once we have accepted that we can find the our own place. Finding "contradictions" has only shown me that there is more than one way to take this journey, and that there is no magic escalator to get us to the top. For my part, thanks to everyone that takes the time to share their knowledge.

Spesh

My guess is that the transparency issue had less to do with the amount of advice available to writers and more with the difficulty of obtaining solid information about the financial underpinnings of the publishing business as it adjusts to the electronic era.

In times of uncertainty, people will always want to know the one, true, "right way."

It doesn't exist and not all purveyors of opinion should be granted the same level of credibility.

I read Rachael's blog because (in general) it seems credible and provides useful info. My comment, however, is opinion-based, not fact-based. Reader beware.

~ Jim

This writing endeavor continues to humble me. Recently, I reread Pride and Prejudice and watched the movie. (2005--best version out there, even though it's not the "purist's" favorite. Keira Knightley = Elizabeth Bennet IMHO.)

I marveled at Jane Austen all over again...she wrote that incredible novel in nine months, ON PAPER, with a PEN. What novel-writing guidebooks existed in 1813? What webinar did she take? What websites did she visit?

Don't get me wrong--I want information, and I need it, badly--I'm no Jane Austen (hahahahah). But information will only get you so far. The imagination required to be a novelist can't be neglected. Perhaps, like Lizzy Bennet, we should spend less time cramming info into our heads and more time being arch and playful, taking long walks and rejoicing in the ridiculous among us. ;)

Rachelle, I think you do a great job balancing both aspects of novel-writing. You remind us to unplug and let loose. Seems like we continue to need those reminders, in my humble opinion. :)

"And why do so many people write me with the most basic publishing questions imaginable, that could be answered fifty different ways from one quick Google search?"

Because, when they do a Good search, the question is answered FIFTY DIFFERENT WAYS. They (we) are looking for an authoritative answer (or even a majority consensus). It took me over a week to come up with a "standard manuscript format," which, it turns out, is anything but a standard. I had to wade through countless conflicting instructions from people and sites all claiming to be authorities on the subject. In the end, I took bits and pieces from each.

Perhaps what we need is not more information on how to do X, but a little advice on whether X is actually all that important in the first place. There is a huge fear in the budding author world that an out-of-place title, or a mis-formatted ellipsis is going to give a potential agent just the excuse they need to reject yet another manuscript, with the requisite evil grin and maniacal laughter (an image perpetuated by things like #queryfail).

Tell us which things are absolutely essential to get right; which things are nice to have, but not essential; and which things make absolutely no difference.

I've decided not to run in circles any more. That's what it feels like when one site says, "do this," and another says, "don't do it."

I'm going to write the novel in my heart. It's my story and I've read pleanty like mine on the best seller's list that di what another says is wrong and will keep me unpublishable.

I'm going to write for the love of it and the joy it brings my soul. Then I'm going to query agents who represent the authors I love. If that does not work, I'll start reading all the do's and don'ts again that contradict each other and what's selling.

There is ALOT of information out there-- my frustration stems from my own tendency to get too bogged down in too many details and in conflicting information. Maybe we just need to be more discerning and focus on the basics rather than looking for the "magic formula."
Thanks, Rachelle!

I think it's just part of a writer's growing process. At each bit of new advice you think, "This is it! THIS is why I've been getting rejected."

Then you get rejected some more.

Eventually you learn that it's as much luck/timing as it is skill, but that takes a long time. I, for one, am super glad for all the info and wouldn't trade it for anything.

Great QUESTIONS! I think it is that we look for the "quick" answers, the instant success, perhaps even the easy way, and at least for me, it is the process of writing, pulling your thoughts together AND then finding the Right time and place and agent. I think that self-publishing and the advertisement of that, brings along a misrepresentation of what it takes.
Yes, there are a few that have that natural talent to sit and write that miracle masterpiece and sell it the first time. But the focus should be more on the craft rather than the end result.

I agree that there's WAY too much info out there. And a lot of it is contradictory...but I think there are certain themes that you find repeated everywhere.

Like, you gotta have a great voice, the story has to have good pacing, and readers have to care about the characters. There may be a few others, but after that, I think things are mostly subjective.

For me it's useful to focus on two or three blogs rather than surfing every writer/agent/editor blog out there. Your blog and Nathan's blog pretty much cover everything a writer needs to know...imho

I agree that too much information makes me a little frustrated. It's like being on a yo yo of "you can do its" and "never get your hopes up." It's easy to lose sight of just sitting down and writing the story that is in you.

I think people don't want to face how subjective this business is, and are trying hard to objectify it. They also perceive huge competition because the plethora of such sites makes it seem as if EVERYbody is writing and is getting better at it. I've heard there are more people trying to write than ever before, and have no idea whether that's true or it just looks that way. Why do they ask such basic questions, even with all the info out there? Maybe because there are just a lot of people who want to ask a pro a "quick question" rather than do their own research. It puzzles me, because I'd always rather research on my own, but evidently a lot of people aren't that way.

Y'all are very insightful and I'm really enjoying your comments. It's great for me to hear the writer's perspective. Many of you are hitting the nail on the head, I think, with the idea that this business is subjective yet we all fight to find "objective truth" somewhere. I also resonate with the problem of trying to sort through what's important and what's not.

Thanks for everyone's perspectives... keep 'em coming!

I agree -- there is so much information out there! Personally, I find it overwhelming. Two years ago when I started writing my YA novel, I stopped reading anything about publishing. It just freaked me out, to be honest. I focused on the writing, and then the rewriting and editing.

I'm just now coming out from under the covers to read about the rest of it.

I'm not sure the advice is that contradictory -- or maybe I just haven't read enough? Everyone seems to be saying the same things: hone your craft, write well, ask for feedback, follow submission guidelines carefully (which vary from place to place), and perhaps most importantly -- don't quit your day job! ;-)

One step at a time.

Not more difficult, no. But I need to keep things streamlined. There's only so many blogs I can read in a day or week, and those that are truly helpful quickly rise to the top. Yours is one.

When in doubt on standards, I turn to The Chicago Manual of Style. I realize that not everyone follows The Chicago Manual of Style (as is evidenced by the sloppy way some publisher number pages), but if I do then people can’t say I’m wrong, only that I didn’t follow their guidelines.

As for why someone would ask a question they could easily find through Google, that’s somewhat like asking why people go to church when they can read the Bible at home. What a search engine can’t do is apply it to our specific situation. It is always helpful to have someone who’ll say, “This is how this applies to you.” Experience has shown me that I can spend hours trying to understand something enough to know what to do, but if I go to an expert he can probably tell me in less than a minute.

I think your blog has been a huge help to me, and I feel empowered that I know more about how the "system" works.

I think writers need to remember that even if you have the PERFECT query letter, it doesn't mean you have the perfect book; whether the fail be the idea, the writing or even that your proposed book is great, but it's been done.

One problem, if you can call it that, with the wealth of informaiton out there is that it's not always consisistent. For instance, one agent blogger says in regards to queries 'Put the hook right out front' and another says 'Briefly introduce yourself and your project first.' I think I've learned to put these disparate pieces together as "the industry is subjective, and there are some definite no-nos, but for the most part you're dealing with people who all have opinions and preferences." I've seen some writers, though, who are driven nuts by this--how to write a query to please everyone, how to write an opening to hook everyone. I think the answer is that you can't :) Just do the best you can with what you have (and tailor your query to each agent, like you know to do anyways!).

To be honest, there's also quite a bit of bad info out there--folks have to learn to tell a good source (industry blog, agent website) from a crummy one (opinionated writer, seven-year-old article on rights agreements). It's so easy to create a website and have a presence that I've definitely seen some very misleading but very professional-looking sources out there.

As for why you get questions on the most basic stuff--you seem nice and it's easier to barrage you than search Google?

I am addicted to information. That said, i do think there is simply too much on the internet, and its tempting to spend all my time collecting it and not enough time doing it. Lol! God bless!

When I query, I read the guidelines and blogs carefully. If Agent A says "include a bio" I include a bio. If Agent B says "I don't care who you are, just tell me about your story," I take the bio out. I don't have a one-size-fits-all query. I think a lot of writers think "multiple submissions" means sending the exact same query out to a hundred agents. And this is where they get confused and frustrated. Perhaps they should follow the directions? ;-)

And, as several people have mentioned, if you have a great story, no one's going to reject it because you included a bio or didn't.

There is a ton of information out there, but I think it is wise to be selective. Join some reputable writers groups, ask opinions on which books to read and follow, take classes, do whatever you can to improve your craft, but even after all that, you're still left with the fact that this entire business is subjective. Don't fall for the marketing title of such books like, "Writing The Breakout Novel" - sure, great advice, but following it does not necessarily mean your book will be picked up. I think this might be a stumbling block for many new writers. As people have said, you want to be published so badly that sometimes common sense is left sitting by the side of the road. There are no guarantees in life, in writing, in whatever you pursue. Do your best, pray for direction, leave the rest up to God. And try not to get discouraged. Yes, I am talking to myself!

I think it's good to start with some basic books about publishing and writing. Just go to your local B&N and look in the reference section. Buy a few and keep them on your shelf for reference. You'll find out that there isn't all that much variation in advice about how to write a query etc. Agents do have preferences--you can look at their blogs or websites before you send a query. I'd also suggest following a few good publishing blogs. When you have a question about query letters and so on, check their blog archives first before asking your crit group etc. Then you know you're getting your information from a good source.

In my opinion, if people are writing you with simple questions that they should already know through research, they're doing it for a few reasons:

1) They're not that smart.

2) They're lazy.

3) They're trying to connect with you on a personal level in order to establish a relationship without conforming to the proper query process.

When my co-author and I completed our book, I took the time to research in the area of submissions. That's when I immediately put on the brakes. My co-author is an English major and she knew the book was polished. I agreed but after quickly researching, it didn't take me long to realize, writing the book was the easy part! In fact, I was warned by many experts, it would take months of learning the craft of the submission process before I would be ready to send out the first query. This is the time when many would-be authors, fall by the wayside; they don't wish to put in the time. It is understandable.

It didn't take me long to find Noah Lukeman's "freebies" on Amazon where he painstainkinly outlined how to write a query. I then found information written by him on Landing an Agent.

I also listened to podcasts by Ted Weinstein. I was like a sponge that knew it needed to soak up as much information out there as possible, no matter how long it took. Only then would I be able to form my own creations as it pertained to composing a query, synopsis and proposal. I purchased the following highly recommended books:

Guide to Query Letters by Wendy Burt-Thomas.

How to Write a Book Proposal by Michael Larsen.

Jeff Herman's Guide to Book Publishers, Editors & Literary Agents.

In addition to studying these books over and over again, I continued to research heavily on the web by way of blogs, articles and recommended sites.

This is not an easy process. It takes time to learn the process but once you learn it, you will have it for life or as long as you wish to continue to write.

I now have a clear picture, from all that I have gathered of how to write a query, synopsis or proposal. I wouldn't dream of writing to an agent and take up their valuable time in order to ask what I should have taken the time to find out on my own.

To tell you the truth, it's sort of like cutting in line. Right now, I'm standing in line by sending out my "query" the proper way after close to a year of studying the process. I personally feel that people who contact an agent to ask a question they should already know are trying to cut in line due to one of the three reasons I listed above.

If I were an agent, I wouldn't answer them. I would spend more time on the writers who wrote the query, put the time in and followed the proper process.

In my opinion, if people are writing you with simple questions that they should already know through research, they're doing it for a few reasons:

1) They're not that smart.

2) They're lazy.

3) They're trying to connect with you on a personal level in order to establish a relationship without conforming to the proper query process.

When my co-author and I completed our book, I took the time to research in the area of submissions. That's when I immediately put on the brakes. My co-author is an English major and she knew the book was polished. I agreed but after quickly researching, it didn't take me long to realize, writing the book was the easy part! In fact, I was warned by many experts, it would take months of learning the craft of the submission process before I would be ready to send out the first query. This is the time when many would-be authors, fall by the wayside; they don't wish to put in the time. It is understandable.

It didn't take me long to find Noah Lukeman's "freebies" on Amazon where he painstainkinly outlined how to write a query. I then found information written by him on Landing an Agent.

I also listened to podcasts by Ted Weinstein. I was like a sponge that knew it needed to soak up as much information out there as possible, no matter how long it took. Only then would I be able to form my own creations as it pertained to composing a query, synopsis and proposal. I purchased the following highly recommended books:

Guide to Query Letters by Wendy Burt-Thomas.

How to Write a Book Proposal by Michael Larsen.

Jeff Herman's Guide to Book Publishers, Editors & Literary Agents.

In addition to studying these books over and over again, I continued to research heavily on the web by way of blogs, articles and recommended sites.

This is not an easy process. It takes time to learn the process but once you learn it, you will have it for life or as long as you wish to continue to write.

I now have a clear picture, from all that I have gathered of how to write a query, synopsis or proposal. I wouldn't dream of writing to an agent and take up their valuable time in order to ask what I should have taken the time to find out on my own.

To tell you the truth, it's sort of like cutting in line. Right now, I'm standing in line by sending out my "query" the proper way after close to a year of studying the process. I personally feel that people who contact an agent to ask a question they should already know are trying to cut in line due to one of the three reasons I listed above.

If I were an agent, I wouldn't answer them. I would spend more time on the writers who wrote the query, put the time in and followed the proper process.

I love publishing blogs, and I'm thankful for the agents who write about how to submit and the best way to craft a winning query.

That being said, it makes me crazy when one agent freaks out if the title and word count appear in the first line of a query and another agent says it's fine. Or if one agent's pet peeve is a letter ending in "thank you for your time" and another says it's imperative. I'm happy to move things around if agents specify, but I think it makes writers freak out about what to do when an agent does NOT specify! With so much information, we get caught up on insignificant details.

And I agree. There's an element of wishing it were easier! "If only I had more info..." Not the case. We have more than we can handle as it is! (but, um, keep it coming. love your blog :)

Are you kidding? I've learned TONS from reading publishing industry blogs. Nor do I expect one size fits all answers. There aren't any in the rest of life so I wouldn't look for them in publishing either.

To me, I think what frustrates writers is simply the fact that it takes years to get published (usually). This is natural. Writing books and submitting them is our equivalent of job hunting.

And how many people besides writers takes years to find a job?

But that's the deal we signed up for when writing claimed us.

Yes...there is just too much contradictory and sometimes discouraging information out there. It's not just on the agents/authors/publishing blogs either. It's also in the magazines. When a friend of mine handed me the WD's issue on Memoirs it made me want to burn my manuscript. I felt like, "what's the point?" I put it aside for the summer and tried to forget about it but it kept nagging at me. I've now decided to transform it into something more "sellable" a novel based on a true story. I'm not even picking it up until after the kids go back to school. I've also eliminated reading many blogs telling me the best way to get an agent/published/query, yada yada yada. I figure the most important lesson I can learn is to not listen to everyone and write the best darn book I can. What happens afterwards will dictate what areas I need to read more on. Too much information can be a bad and discouraging thing. I'm following my heart on this one.

I sometimes find that I have TOO much information available. A lot of it is contradictory, too. One book/blog will tell me that the plot should do this, while another says something completely different. I also find that, while I follow tons of writing blogs, I hardly have any time to keep up with them. I read the ones that seem most important. In the end, I'm trying to do the best I can with what I have, and collecting advice as I go along.

I think there is plenty of information out there, but finding the answer to a particular question can be time consuming. It's easier to ask someone than to dig through books and blogs for what we want to know.

People need different things at different stages of their career, and sometimes it can get confusing knowing what we actually need to know at a particular point in our writing journey.

When I decided to actively work at becoming an author, I read a lot of blogs and articles about how to write, how to get published, and how to market my work. Now I'm at the point where I check 5 of my favorite agent blogs every weekday, and spend the rest of my writing time writing, or researching information for my blog and novel.

This is just my opinion so take it with a grain of salt. For me, when I first started reading industry blogs and truly learning about the writing and publishing process, the amount of information was paralyzing.

I almost gave up on two different projects because of all the contradictory information. (There were other reasons, too.) It felt as though I would never learn enough of the nuances to ever be successful. Then there were all the rules. No adverbs, yes adverbs, add description, don't add description. The list can go on for a good while.

But then I reached a point where I'd synthesized enough information to be able to look at it all with a clearer head.

Looking at it all, I found a balance. Yes, I need to worry on a hidden level about the rules and about the nitty-gritty mechanics of the industry. No, I do not need to conform to every single rule of writing put out there in the world, as long as I know why it exists and why I'm breaking it.

There are some hard and fast rules, like following submission guidelines. But then, ones like no adverbs, are more fluid. The ultimate message is to write your book, revise and edit to make it shine, then jump into the rule book and figure out how to make your book stand out despite its flouting of the rules.

To those hand-wringing writers, I say... hogwash.

There is good information out there, and it's remarkably consistent. While formatting details vary, the principles are steady: write the best book you can, do your homework, polish your query 'til it shines like the buddha's bald belly, and then... hope for a little luck.

Incidentally, "How to Write a Great Query" by Noah Lukeman is a fantastic resource.
http://www.lukeman.com/greatquery/download.htm

Hey Rachelle, I'm an aspiring author and I think what you're saying is somewhat true. Sometimes it seems like there is so much information - there isn't really enough. I've spent weeks (I'm guessing) just looking at query and synopsis examples, and how to do word count, etc. For awhile I was out of my mind with confusion, but then I just decided to let it all go and follow some of the advice, the advice that I thought applied best to me. So far, it's worked out great.

I agree 100 percent that there is too much information, and I think the problem is compounded by the fact that 99 percent of all writers (if not more) will never achieve their writing dreams. This is a hard fact to accept, and so writers (including me) will keep searching for that mythical blog post or website that will give them the keys to the kingdom (while going crazy in the process). I know this because I was guilty of hunting for it, too.

I read far fewer how-to-query, how-publication-works blogs than I used to, and I've been writing a lot more since.

What I know is this: my first crappy manuscript several years ago got exactly one request for a partial. My third one got 14 partial requests and 7 full requests. This happened because I got better from manuscript to manuscript, not because I read a thousand blogs (no offense, Rachelle).

Basically, authors need to read one blog post about how how to query (either on this blog, or over at Nathan Bransford's site), and that's really all you need to know.

If you've written a good enough book, and you write a good enough query (and you could do a lot worse than to write a query that sounds like jacket copy of any book at the bookstore), you'll probably get an agent. If not, you won't.

Absolutely...

I haven't read the other comments, so this is no doubt a repeat of theirs. Yes, there is a glut. Much of it, as you noted, is subjective and confounds other information.

I really don't think any more information could possibly be communicated other than for agents, etc., to keep their desires and/or restrictions for material current. Beyond that, what's left?

Hey Rachel,
New to your blog. I really like this post. When I first started this process I read until my eyes were bleeding Times New Roman. I know we must be informed and professional, but I think there's a line we can cross that causes us to leave our writing. Eventually I found a FEW books and blogs that I read and reread. That's just me.

I have faith that deep down agents and publishers still want a good book. One that both engages a vast audience, and says something meaningful. I wonder of many of us, starting out on this journey, have lost that faith. Perhaps, many of us think the only way to get in the door is to jump through hoops.

Just a few thoughts. Thanks again! God Bless.

DES

Yes!

There is so much information out there. And that's probably why some people feel it's contradictory. Because it is:
Should you seek an agent or go indie?
Should you direct email potential buyers of your book or not?
Should you write your query this way or that way

Answers to these and a gazillion questions are out there. And yes, what you find may be conflicting - we, as authors, need to take the time to read and digest the information (thinking of it as that - as information that will guide our decisions, not as instructions spelling out what we must do).

I've only really participated in the blogosphere for just over a year now. I've been blown away by the amount of info that is out there. Good info, too.

The bad side of it is that reading it all has really cut into my writing time. But the good side of it is that I feel that, these last 6 months, I have just come through an in-depth short course about the publishing industry. And I am finding that I am not reading many of the articles any more (in spite of the enticing Twitter feed titles!) because I am at the stage on that learning curve where I am now reading more of the same-old, same-old.

I do think there is too much information out there and like you said a lot of it's contradictory. For me, I've had to seriously narrow down what I read (and WHO I read) to keep from info overload. Obsessing over what's the "right way to do it" has a negative impact on my creativity, so I have to distance myself. But then when I do, oddly enough, I feel like I'm missing out on vital information that I need to know. It's a real catch-22.

In my opinion, the path to traditional publishing has become too cumbersome for many of us. A little more standardization would certainly be helpful. I think I wrote a good book. I self-published because I had neither the time nor inclination to humor the system with queries including certain information written in a certain font and attached (or not attached) in a certain fashion so that someone might (or might not) look at it and maybe (or maybe not) get back to me possibly within 90 days or so. To this point, I have been very happy with my decision.

I think there is a ton of info out there, but the problem is WHY people are seeking it out such small details.

Everyone wants to believe that they have a great manuscript, and the only reason it could be rejected is because of something small/silly like having 1.5 inch margins instead of 1 inch. Not true. In my experience as an editor, most stories are rejected because of the story and writing ability. But writers don't want to believe that, because that's much harder to accept and more personal than being rejected because of formatting.

Hi Rachelle,
In a perfect world, all of the publishing information would be universal. Right now, there is so much confusion because each publishing house has there own criteria for submission.
With all of the books and blogs out there on the subject, the information just becomes more and more confusing. I wonder how many great books and stories are passed over because the writer was misinformed by a blog or a 'how to publish' book. Or just unsure of which were the correct steps to take.

Thanks for putting this subject on the table, Rachelle.
Whew! I'm glad I got that off my chest:-)

I think the problem isn't too much information (LOVE all the information!!!), but unrealistic expectations of some of those reading the blogs.

We are used to getting what we want, to a point. There is a "how to" book for pretty much everything. But publishing isn't like fixing your dishwasher or changing your oil. There is no fool proof way, an exact science that tells you, "If you do ______ then you WILL be published!" Unless of course we're talking about self-pubbing, and that's a whole different topic.

When it comes down to it, everyone who wants to be, will NOT be published. They can all follow the same steps, read the same blogs, devour the same books on craft, and there will be many who just won't get there. It's like when you go on a job interview, you have all the PERFECT qualifications, but you still don't get picked. Why? Because there were 50 other just as qualified people out there and only one job.

I definitely don't think there's too much. I think one has to ease into it all and then look at it as maintenance.
When I started stalking... um, reading... publishing blogs there was a LOT out there and it was all new to me. I stuck to a few and went through their archives obsessively. Nathan Bransford, you, a few others. Then it became keeping up on them as RSS feeds instead of digging through all the time. Now I've added tons more to my reader and I usually don't go through archives as thoroughly.

Sure, I see a lot of repeat and contrary information. If it's an agent in my genre that I might look at querying I have a spreadsheet so I can mark their personal preferences (Move the paragraph of why I'm targeting you to the top? No problem!) because with so many I won't remember who wants what and when you mention it in a blog or twitter it's not easy to find again like a submissions page... BUT those things are usually preferences not absolutes. I don't pull my hair out wondering which is right. If I've neglected to mark some down enough agents have said "write well and stop stressing this" that I've figured the basics stay the same and the rest is gravy. But if I can tweak it so it fits a particular agent's prefs all the better for me!

I think many of the things you've said sum up the issue perfectly. Writing is an art form, but so many people seem to be looking for a road map. It's not a math equation - the answer isn't the same for every person.

In the end, all the advice in the world can't substitute for confidence in one's own work, and a desire to put in the time needed to get it noticed.

I think the wealth of info available now is great. And yet, as an author who broke in before the write-osphere existed, I wonder if it's actually making it harder for new writers.

About the only mistakes I didn't make were bragging about my books and claiming they were going to be bestsellers. I made every other mistake. Nowadays a writer who makes such mistakes can end up looking like a real idiot-- someone who doesn't even bother to read the blogs.

I wonder if it was easier in the past to be forgiven for new-writer mistakes.

My answer is yes and no. I honestly didn't do much research before I queried my book. I was really naive and that probably hurt me some (sorry about that!). Now that I've read your blog and other books, I'm starting to learn how the industry works and that makes me a bit more hesitant, but also keeps me from making rookie mistakes like sending a query at the wrong time or to the wrong agent.

I, for one, am grateful that agents, editors, and other successful* writers are willing to share. I don’t think it’s possible to have TOO much info. I believe the issue is new writers, or those just learning the publishing business expect the “… standard rich and famous contract.**” And, there isn’t really one to be found.

(*Definitions of success vary depending on which blog/email/forum post you read. - LOL)
(** I hate to admit it – but that comes from the Muppet Movie.)

I liken the process of learning the industry (and writing in general, for that matter) to reading a good book. The plot may be crystal clear, but the theme of the story is woven in bits and pieces throughout. Read another book – different crystal clear plot, equally enigmatic theme. Understanding the industry is finding the commonality between those themes and discovering how the author hid them in plain sight.

Finding the “truth” in this business is a lot like standing away from a TV, with each blog and post represented by a single pixel. Each has a tiny piece in the whole but is not specifically necessary for the whole image to come through.

Specific conventions may be used by the majority of industry professionals, but as one posted said (paraphrasing): Whatever you do is fine so long as it isn’t on scented paper and comes with bribes of wine and chocolate – unless of course that’s what the agent/editor is expecting. ;-)

Contradictory advice is frustrating, but the publishing industry isn't a machine. It's made up of people who have their own opinions and ideas on what makes for a great query or synopsis or partial manuscript. As they say, though, if the story is great, it will get noticed. Unfortunately, a writer also has to contend with figuring out how to describe her story so that it sounds great, as well as finding the best target agents that might like the story. It takes a lot of time.

I wish it were easier. I feel so overwhelmed sometimes that I wonder if getting published will ever happen for me. If I ever do, it will be God that helps me through it, because I don't think I could do it without him. It's not going to happen by my own strength--that's all I know.

I think its overload of information--and I think that some of it comes from people who don't know what they're talking about as much. Not that the fault is all the agents and editors'. The writers have made it harder on themselves by not being patient and learning the trade. If more people would take the time to learn the craft of writing instead of shooting out amateur query letters to everyone they can Google search, the editors and agents might be a little easier to contact.

Yes, there's a lot of information and some of it is contradictory. Just like when my son was a newborn and everyone and her grandmother wanted to tell how to take care of a baby. I read and did research and listened politely to advice, but I also used my heart, my gut, and my own common sense.

I think you, Rachelle, and other agents, editors, and authors are so generous to share your time and talent with us through blogs. I only have a finite amount of time, so I have to limit the information that I have to wade through in both blogs and books. That's why I pick what's best for me to read each day---again trusting myself and my own wisdom.

We are fortunate to live in a time where so much information can be gleaned gratis. If those who seek more "transparency" mean the publishing industry must be more open in the divulgence of publishing figures, then those comments are directed at folks who are already published. No prob.

If, however, those comments were indeed referring to withholding of information necessary to BECOMING published, then I would say they are a little unrealistic. First, that word, transparency, has become such a buzzword lately, I feel it has lost much of its punch. Second, like you mentioned, there is a veritable overload of information available. Perhaps the confusion has created an opaque barrier to the knowledge they seek. I could see that. :)

We writers tend to be such a fragile bunch, really. Our egos are tied to our art, our self-worth tied to the craft. And when we've birthed our masterpieces, we tend to search out the most detailed information to send that puppy on its merry way. It is self-defeating at times, cathartic maybe. Much can be gained in these pursuits, but much can be lost as well. Some of us lose our faith, some lose their temper, some their minds.

I don't blame the writers, I don't blame the medium or the agents or the publishers. It is such a personal journey, not everyone will be served in a way that is constructive. It is like the disclaimer for a diet: results may vary.

Personally, I think it's one of those things where you can never know what the other side looks like.

No matter how much information about publishing is out there, a person just can't get a solid picture of what the process is like without experiencing it.

I have not experienced it yet. I know that I sometimes wish for some kind of exact step-by-step of when someone calls and what they say and when you go into the office and what kind of meetings there are, etc.

But I know that I'm never going to have a grasp on it until I go through it. It will always be veiled in mystery until I experience it.

For me, the information is helpful, but daunting.

I've written a novel and have been revising it since January. Now that I'm about to query it, I'm terrified about the process. No amount of information is going to ease this.

If I understand correctly, I am supposed to thoroughly research each agent who represents my genre. This includes reading several novels they've represented so that I find an agent who would appreciate my style/voice. (If I pick an agent whose material matches mine too closely, I may be inappropriate for her because I'd be competing against her other authors.) I should query extensively (but not to multiple agents in the same agency), which means I need to read about twenty or so novels for every batch of agents I query.

If I do the math of how much reading I should be doing--and I should not quit my day job--this leaves me about eight minutes a day to write.

Then it's all dependent on a query letter, which in essence looks extremely simple: what is this novel about? Summarizing the novel into a paragraph or two is quite a task, but I understand the need. And my novel summarizes very easily. Except that the summary misses just about everything interesting in the novel and getting that into the query feels monumental.

Even if I nail the query letter and perfectly encapsulate my novel into one page, I don't get any guarantee that anyone will ever look at the book, let alone read it.

It's daunting.

For me it is worrying about reaching that standard of perfection since publishing as we know it is changing. Also, with so much info out there, writers can spend all their time researching the answers and not enough time writing. I also find that it is hard to find info for my particular genre of fiction (children's Christian Sci-fi). Right now, my biggest question is when do I know I am ready to submit a proposal (for my devotional)?

I began this blogging and surfing for other blogs in October, 2009.

Until that time, my "google" was reserved for research, live search for locations of different houses or landmarks ... maps and historical background ... and was not a source of information "dumping."

One of the first things we all learn is to avoid is ab info-dump ... especially early on. Don't put your reader to sleep with too much talk/talk/talk.

I don't want to sound antiquated, but it might be better for some of us to surf less and work more ... she says as she reads your blog daily. :)

"You have to write the best book you can, properly query agents, and see what happens. Beyond that, there are countless views on exactly what process to follow. You can keep asking until the cows come home but you’re not going to get that one magical piece of advice that is going to finally bring you success."

That pretty much says it all.
Thanks

I don't experience feeling of frustration around the lack of information. It's seems pretty cut and dried to me after spending the last year or two following agent blogs and reading info online. But I'm also not to the query stage yet, so...

My thought is that you can do everything perfectly and still not get published. It's the nature of the beast. It's a bummer, but it is what it is.

Please excuse the typo ... "is an info-dump" Sorry.

Rachelle: I think the increased availability of information is both a blessing and a curse. To those who understand how to analyze, harmonize and use information effectively in changing circumstances, it is an immeasurable blessing. To those who are confused by ideas like "If A then B, but if X then Y" it's confusing. In other words: those who have the skills to analyze situations and respond generally benefit from increased input. People who are easily confused or lack good analytical skills do not.

Personally, I benefit a great deal from blogs like this one, and I think most of your readers do too. Computer programmers, attorneys and security experts will generally tell you that you don't program/draft/plan for the ends of the bell curve - the ones who already know or the ones who will never learn no matter how hard you try. You focus on the ones in the middle, and your blog and others do a fantastic job of that.

Rachelle, thank you for posting this. It resonates strongly with my comment yesterday about the lack of good, comprehensive and transparent information. I’m so glad you’re thinking about it.

However, I don’t think quantity of information is the issue. I think it’s QUALITY. I see a lot of agreement about this in others' comments here. There are endless reams of information available, yet its quality (and preciseness and thoroughness) ranges dramatically. It’s very difficult for writers, especially those newer to the game, to sift through it and make good choices.

Importantly, quality is more of a problem when it comes to information on “what is good/publishable” writing than to procedures such as contacting agents, crafting queries, etc. There’s plenty of excellent info readily available on the how-to’s of the business. And most often a good query flows naturally from a good manuscript and the path that led to its creation.

What’s really missing is info on “what is good/publishable” writing, including current trends about what editors are buying and therefore what agents are looking for in a manuscript. (From my experience as a friend and publicist to many authors, I’ve deduced that what agents are looking for, especially from debut novelists, is far more specific than anybody has stated to date.) Mary DeMuth responded to my comment in your post about “Can’t Get Something for Nothing” agreeing that often questions don’t get answered specifically, as if the info were “a trade secret.” She is absolutely right. I have many fascinating, concrete examples of this in settings ranging from writers workshops to consultations with agents and editors. **I would like to share some of them with you in an e-mail: fodder for future posts?**

My wish-list / suggestion would be to see the creation of some sort of authoritative list or guide or other resource of individuals and organizations willing and able to speak to this with clarity and precision.

Mary concluded her reply to my comment by saying: “I vowed that if I ever figured out how to get published, I’d share that information freely. There are many of us who teach at conferences who give out this information.”

I’d say it’s time to use this as a criteria in evaluating conferences, workshops, classes, writing organizations, teachers and even agent manuscript consultations.

Addition to my previous post: develop industry-wide STANDARDS to use in evaluating the resources available to writers.

Rachel,
It is very true that overall, we are overwhelmed with information. With that said, it's important to weed through such information and apply to ourselves what's going to work and ignore the rest. In fact, there's enough information about the publishing industry so as writers, we don't have an excuse to NOT write accurate query letters, or format manuscripts appropriately, or know where to turn to find the right agent, etc. The ones that aren't following obvious instruction or who e-mail you questions easily found with a Google search, are simply lazy. There's no excuse. We're living in a "What's in it for ME right NOW" society to the point where no one wants to do any real work, such as research. It's a shame, but if that's their attitude, it's very telling about their writing and how they will be as a client. I'm sure the ones who are professional and who do follow instructions, stand out to you. The ones who've taken the time to do their research are above the pack, and I'll bet they're the ones that catch your attention. I personally appreciate blogs (such as yours) and Web sites that keep us informed of what's new in the industry so we can stay on top of things. Reading them shows we're interested enough to care about how to market our art.

I think there is a lot of information out there, too much even, and yet not enough of the right kind of information.

The contradictory information doesn't bother me that much. It's the way it is whenever there are multiple viewpoints. Ask 10 people at the scene of an accident, you get 10 stories. Wait an hour, and you'll have another 5 as people change what they saw. This is just human nature, so I get it that there's nothing definitive.

When I say there isn't enough of the right information, it's that sometimes the information is out of date, sometimes by years, sometimes by minutes. Books about publishing are way past their prime just by being books. It took awhile for them to get written, and then published, and in that time things have changed. The very nature of querying has shifted almost entirely to email, and it wouldn't surprise me in the slightest if eventually it got to the point where a 140 character pitch line via twitter qualified as an initial form of query. Things evolve and change so fast that it's hard to sort out old from new versus different perspectives.

Another area that's difficult to keep up with is genre definitions. Is it romance, mystery, science fiction, fantasy, western, etc.? What about the popular sub genres? Paranormal romance, urban fantasy, thriller, police procedural and others that emerge? It's difficult finding the right people to query for these emerging genres because all of the listings cling to the established definitions.

This is where I also think there's not enough transparent information. Agents are sometimes a little closed-mouthed about what they are looking for. I love the agents that are highly specific on their detailed pages, but others simply put out "looking for commercial fiction" or "most genre fiction". And that's only if authors can find listed agent information on publisher websites. The books (as already mentioned) don't go into that detail, and finding a specific agent's name is sometimes like questing for the Holy Grail.

TMI, no doubt about it. As I went from entry to entry and blog to blog, I grew so confused. Some of the best advice I've had has been from an author who saw one of my comments on your blog. She emailed me and has given me concise, wonderful advice. If people want to learn how to write a query, I recommend they take your webinar, Rachelle. It's worth the money because we get individual feedback from you.

Personally, I think there is a difference between the people who are complaining about the lack of information and the people who are complaining about too much or divergent information. The people who read the blogs, do the research, and actually use Google for information are the ones who have trouble sifting through all the information. The people who are sending personal emails asking questions that can be easily answered online are the people who just don't realize there is a wealth of information already online.

I get emails from friends sometimes, friends who are computer professionals, asking me questions that could be answered in 10 seconds with a google search. It annoys me to no end. I can't imagine how annoyed I would be if I were an agent/editor/etc.

I am a reader of your blog and I also try to follow as many people in the publishing business on their various blogs/twitter. It takes so much time to go through all of the information I receive everyday, and that is time I could be using to write instead. However, I feel like if I DON'T keep up, I'll be missing out on important information. So it's a daily struggle for me to balance that.

I think we writers have a propensity to make matters more difficult than necessary. It's up to each of us to read, study, and screen the info we receive.

In simplest terms, we need to know: how to write a good book, how to format it, and where to submit it.

In the first case--that's up to the writer.

RE: Formatting, there may be a bit of variation but it's not earth shattering. And unless an agent or publishing house places a note on their site to the effect of "If you misplace so much as one comma, you're manuscript is toast!" I'm going to assume they'll be reasonable.

As to the third--where to submit--this info is usually always available on websites or conference faculty pages and it changes all the time. That's life.

I don't see why reasoning out the info presented is causing such a stir.

The authorative list or guide someone mentioned seems redundant to me. That's what agents and editors are doing with their blogs in the first place. And in most cases with a little study it's pretty easy to learn who are the reputable players in the industry.

Besides, one of the big gripes writers have is that it takes so long to get a response on a submission. Can you imagine the time involved in trying to dredge up and post every microscopic little detail of the publishing business?

You think it took a long time to get a response before...

I agree with you, Rachelle. More than enough information is out there, not only on publishing but also on the how-to’s of writing.

With plenty of books and blogs available, I can’t tell you why all writers are still frustrated, but I can tell you what bugs me.

There is NO guaranteed formula.

I’m not talking about a “follow-these-quick-and-easy-steps-to-success-in-publishing” formula. I’m in this for the long and grueling haul. I see the benefit in all the years of honing the craft and learning the business. No, I’m talking about a defined path (however difficult) to publication.

When someone aspires to be a doctor, he/she knows exactly what classes to take as an undergrad, how long it takes to earn a degree from med school, and how much time to spend serving as an intern in order to become “Doctor So-and-So.” It’s so well defined you can mark it on your calendar.

Just ask any best-selling author about his/her journey (or read their memoirs) to learn no such formula exists to become “Published Author So-and-So.” I’m frustrated by the prospect of investing time with no guarantee I’ll ever “earn a degree.” (But not frustrated enough to quit!)

As for your last question, I think people write you with basic questions because they want to connect with you. In this business the only sure-fire formula for a gifted, practiced writer is who you know. And more importantly who knows you.

I think a writer’s prerequisite to build a platform is EXACTLY why a plethora of blogs exists. After all, we aspiring writers need a place to post our comments and connect.

BTW did I mention I have a blog…

nice blog.. have a view of my blog when free.. http://www.lonelyreload.blogspot.com .. do leave me some comment / guide if can.. if interested can follow my blog...

To Shawna Marie Bryant and others who have posted about the frustrations of having no guaranteed results: As a writer you're self-employed. You're running your own business. The doctor analogy is false. The med student knows how many years to a degree. He doesn't know how long it will take to build a name and a reputation and a client base or if he might do something really bogus and have to take a class or twelve over again before he gets that diploma. He doesn't know if he'll graduate just to find that his tiny hometown has just gotten a new doctor. None of us know tomorrow, that's not unique to writers.

I think there is plenty of info available. It can be overwhelming and contradictory so we have to us our heads and our discernment and make some choices, but what if--horrors!--we make the wrong choice.
Can't you please just tell me step by step what to do? In fact, could you come do it for me?
I think that's a lot of what's going on. It's intimidating.

I am grateful for all of the information and advice. And the biggest problem I have is getting ahead of myself. I read about publishing and agents and editors, etc and loose track of the fact that right now I JUST NEED TO FINISH the dang book!

Sorry Wendy, I disagree... mostly.

I am self employed and have been for over 20 years! Believe me, I know what it's like to wonder if I'll be able to pay the mortgage certain months, even after all these years as a successful business owner.

The doctor's degree is like unto the publishing contract. The doctor's successful practice is like unto the number of books sold.

The sheer number of comments on this post give us an idea how too much is simply too much.

Yes, we need the information, to write well, to query successfully, to market and network and keep track of details. It is really up to us to sort out what we truly need to spend time on, and what we don't.

After reading everything I could get my hands on about querying, I figured out the aspects that were generalized, and applied them to a draft query. When I get ready to query a specific agent, I then adjust that draft to suit the agent in question. So, I don't obsessively read posts or articles on querying anymore.

The hard part is knowing when to let go. There is so much information out there, that we fear missing that single critical piece, and spent way too much time searching, and not enough time actually doing the work of the writer.

It's what I like to call a mixed blessing.

Nobody's asked the other half of the question: has all this information helped agents?

Do you get a better quality of query or writing now that you've spent so much time educating people on how to do it?

I'm guessing... not so much. :D

Still, I appreciate the effort. It definitely helped me!

I think it's important to have all the information you can get your hands on. That being said, I also believe the aspiring writer needs to set a time limit everyday on the informaton he/she reads, otherwise ther is no tme for writing. Setting up a routine, I think, is very important to getting in the writing time needed to accomplish a writing project.

While I understand that many could find themselves overwhelmed with the variety of opinions floating around the net, I still find that having so many resources available to me is a blessing.

I'm at that point where I feel like pulling my hair out.

Put the genre in the first line word count. I hate reading query letters where writers think they are cute and hide them at the end of the query letter.

Put the reason you're contacting me in the first line. I want to know you researched me and know what I want.

Don't put any of that other stuff in the first line. I don't care about it. I want to jump into the story and see what it's about.

That's just the first line. And what's really sad, is none of those agents had those preferences on their blogs. Unless you just happened to catch them talking about it you would have no idea.

I want exactly four paragraphs. Just follow the formula. "Yuck, someone else who can't follow the formula."

Wait, wait. There's a magic formula?

I really don't care what agents want as long as they state somewhere in their guidelines they refuse to read queries that do whatever.

We're not trying to be cute or make the agent's job harder. We simply don't know Agent X despises the word "could" and it gives them the shakes.

While I appreciate the information that agents provide online, there is an insane amount of it out there, and because everyone is blogging and tweeting 24/7, it feels as though some agents expect us all to read every post everyday. If we did that for every agent we follow, there would be no time for writing, much less our day jobs and family.

It is frustrating to read nit-picky things that can make or break your query, but that's all part of the process. Before the social media frenzy writers had no clue what individuals liked or didn't like.

We can read everything that's out there, but at the end of the day it comes down to us writing the best manuscript and query we can, and following the submission guidelines.

Best of luck to us all.

While I appreciate the information that agents provide online, there is an insane amount of it out there, and because everyone is blogging and tweeting 24/7, it feels as though some agents expect us all to read every post everyday. If we did that for every agent we follow, there would be no time for writing, much less our day jobs and family.

It is frustrating to read nit-picky things that can make or break your query, but that's all part of the process. Before the social media frenzy writers had no clue what individuals liked or didn't like.

We can read everything that's out there, but at the end of the day it comes down to us writing the best manuscript and query we can, and following the submission guidelines.

Best of luck to us all.

I may be coming at this with a little different perspective than other commenters, as I already have an agent (though I can certainly relate to many of the comments). But I took your blog in a little different way. Lately I've been feeling a little lost in the business of publishing, unsure of where to submit, what to submit(I have several digital publishers plus agent) and I think I'm confused becase YES there is so much info out there! I read about NY publishers switching to digital, I read about agents becoming publishers, I read about this or that sub-genre being dead or a tough sell, I read about Amazon Kindle sales surpassing sales of hard covers and it makes me crazy! What does the future hold? What should my next steps be? The best part of your blog article:

"You have to write the best book you can, properly query agents, and see what happens. Beyond that, there are countless views on exactly what process to follow. You can keep asking until the cows come home but you’re not going to get that one magical piece of advice that is going to finally bring you success."

Thank you! I will just keep writing the best books I can.

I read a tweet from RWA last week quoting Nora Roberts. In response to sentiment that it is so hard to get published these days, she said, "It was always hard." I liked that a lot. It's just plain hard to get published for most us mortal folks. Talent, long hours and perseverance. No amount of studying, no special formula -- no magic wands. Great post.

Is there too much information out there? I would say there probably is and I have to admit that I have added to it (with a book on 'Writing for Children'). But I am not saying that you don't need to know how to write a coherent query letter or how to present your MS of course you do. My point is that if you spend so much time reading all the different ways that you should or shouldn't do this or that, you will have no time to write. The most important thing is to write well and to keep polishing it until it shines.

You do need to get to know the market you are writing for but most of all you need to be professional in your approach. No one owes you a publishing contract.
Publishers and agents want to publish great books that a lot of people will want to read and enjoy - but they also need to earn a living and this is their JOB, not a fun thing they do in their spare time.

Treat your query letter as you would an application for a job.
Research the agent or publisher to find out what they want and in what format. Address it correctly to them. Send them work that is as polished and perfect as you can possibly make it. Be polite.
Act in a professional manner and accept that if your work is not good enough you will need to make it better, but if you have sent it to the wrong agent or publishing company for that kind of book it means you have not done your research well enough.

Writing for publication is not a game - it is wonderful and amazing, heart-rending and difficult, but I do think people often forget that it is a job for all those involved in publishing.

See - now I have added even more to all the information that is out there. :)
But perhaps if you are reading this you should STOP - go back to your manuscript, and get writing!

Imagine that BING Maps, Google Earth, Yahoo Maps, MapQuest, Magellan, Garmin, and TomTom all gave vastly different directions to getting from one place to another. That is the electronic equivalent of asking five old men hanging out in front of the feed store how to find a farm house two towns over. Before you leave them, they will have started an argument among themselves and confused you completely.
All you needed was a relatively new map.
There are hundreds of agents, writing magazines, writers, editors, and bloggers all telling us different turns NOT to take.
Yes, too much information is making it harder. It makes us believe that you are all right, and that we need to navigate the impossibly narrow courses that lie between the rocks placed by you, Nathan, Janet, Kristin, et. al.
It is great that you all tell us the things that make you tend to reject. But, while we scour the blogosphere to find all the obstacles in our way, we forget that there are some well-paved roads.
Write well. Revise, edit and polish. Query EVERYBODY.

Hi Rachelle,

I'm a total newbie to this process. And after doing alot of research and reading many of the wonderful agent blogs out there I have to say that the blogs provided by agents such as yourself, have been invaluable to me.

At first I was overwhelmed by the different opinions in format, queries, etc. But finally, I got to that point where it all made sense.

Simply put you need three basic elements:
1. a clear concise query letter following the common guidelines given (and there is a common thread).

2. A well written, interesting story (this of course is the most important).

and

3. It needs to be something that the agent you are querying is either looking for or intrigued by/interested in.

That about sums it up...again, thank you so much for all the time and effort that you and other agents invest in educating authors on the process.

I wanted to be commenter number 100. In my experience, people want detailed, personalized information on how to get their work published. They don't want to do any of the research and figure it out for themselves. They aren't interested in general information. They want specifics for their particular situation. This just plain lazy and unrealistic.

I love how informative your posts are. Too be honest if there were no industry blogs I would feel lost. The information I've gleaned over the last three years is staggering in comparison to what I could have learned through magazines or books. Also, the industry has been in flux and blogs bring together information faster and more personably. It makes me feel not only connected, but like I've got front row seats to the best show in town.

TMI

know no
way weigh

knot not
four for fore
eye I aye

Definitely too much information out there, making it hard to know which sources are worthwhile. I consider your blog one of the worthwhile ones, by the way.

I think your third paragraph nailed most of the issue. For those of us who are newbies or 'newer' to the storytelling world, all the information out there can be daunting to digest. I believe the key to understanding is to find good, knowledgeable sources and listen to their advice. Then do a little research. See if that advice was sound or in the majority. Knowledge can be powerful. You just need to learn who and what to listen to.

you guys are great...you've given tons of information...but for me sometimes I get lost in all that information. I need to keep things simple...short...almost in point form. I've also stopped reading alot of the how to's and keep it down to just a couple. But...know this Rachelle...I do appreciate you guys posting this stuff on how to write up a query etc....

In one word: overwhelming

There's a lot of information but you just have to sift through to find what suits you. Some bloggers (like Rachelle)will strike a chord and you'll follow along, others you won't bother so much with. My main problem is that I find so much so fascinating that I spend too much time writing my own blog, reading other blogs, posting comments and getting diverted by intriguing links when I should be writing.

I think a lot of people are looking for a quick fix (just like me with wanting to lose 10kg by like, tomorrow)and don't appreciate that writing is work like any other. Plumbers won't build a successful business by sitting around reading, thinking and talking about plumbing - and neither will writers!

Rachelle, are you allowed to post excerpts from emails sent to you on your blog? Say a monthly round up of 'should have been googled questions'. Wouldn't that cut the numbers down a bit?

I watched Sherlock Holmes last night and one scene was so relevant to writers wading through the blogosphere. Sherlock discovers a secret room and rather than standing staring at the magnificence of it, he homes straight in on the pieces of evidence he wants to steal and gets out of there leaving the officers ogling the room. Isn't this what we should all be doing, quick in and out and back to writing world?

I think one reason for info overload is the pressure to have something new to blog about. So many bloggers regurgitate publishing news and yes its useful but its wasting our time. My blog has none of that (nor the subscribers) but I hesitate to bring more of the same news to everyone when all I want to do is write.

Rachelle, are you allowed to post excerpts from emails sent to you on your blog? Say a monthly round up of 'should have been googled questions'. Wouldn't that cut the numbers down a bit?

I watched Sherlock Holmes last night and one scene was so relevant to writers wading through the blogosphere. Sherlock discovers a secret room and rather than standing staring at the magnificence of it, he homes straight in on the pieces of evidence he wants to steal and gets out of there leaving the officers ogling the room. Isn't this what we should all be doing, quick in and out and back to writing world?

I think one reason for info overload is the pressure to have something new to blog about. So many bloggers regurgitate publishing news and yes its useful but its wasting our time. My blog has none of that (nor the subscribers) but I hesitate to bring more of the same news to everyone when all I want to do is write.

I don't think the issue is that there is too much information about there for aspiring writers. I think the problem is that many aspiring writers think that following the instructions on formatting a manuscript, querying agents etc is *all* they need to do to get their book published. They think they've done everything right, and they're bitter that nobody wants to publish them. It doesn't seem to occur to them that the reason they haven't achieved any success isn't because they formatted their manuscript badly or didn't write a great query letter, but because their book stinks to high heaven.

Directing my comment to Joanne Shephard above:

With all due respect, I don't believe it has anything to do with bitterness over not being able to get published. The fact that there is conflicting and confusing information out there is a real annoyance. If we are to write, we don't have time to pour over every bit of info we can find. Much of the information is put forth in generalities, when commonality would be more helpful. If you get a set of instructions from one publisher or agent, it would be more productive to know that this is it. This is the way to query or approach a publisher. Instead, each is just slightly different enough that the odds of satisfying the person reading the query is slim. I would be thrilled if I could just match the info of two professionals. Then those would be the instructions I would follow.

These are my thoughts and I respect all the other thoughts and opinions out there, but I don't think bringing the word 'bitter' into it, explains any of it.

Have a blessed day!:-)

@Cynthia

Yes, but in way, you're almost proving my whole point - not about bitterness, necessarily (although I'll return to that point in a minute) but about the fact that you're putting too much emphasis on slavishly following instructions and thinking that's all it will take to get your work noticed. Of course all agents will have slightly different preferences, because they're human beings with different likes and dislikes and different opinions. A lot of writers are too busy looking for some magic formula that will work every time when they're querying an agent, and think that this is all that matters.

Moreover, even if there was a magic formula, if a writer has little talent and their novel is badly written, they could produce the greatest query in the world and follow every piece of advice there was in approaching agents and they still wouldn't get published. At the end of the day, you can't make a silk purse out of a sow's ear, and about 99.9 per cent of unpublished novels are sow's ears.

Frankly, I think people should be grateful that advice is out there. Lots of agents have blogs and websites now, and even if they don't all agree on what they want to see in a query or a manuscript, they are taking the time to be helpful and to engage with aspiring writers. What do you want them to, all get together one day, put their personal views to one side and come to a consensus on what makes the perfect query / manuscript, and stick to those rigid criteria from thenceforth, just to give amateur writers a definitive, inflexible and set-in-stone process for approaching an agent? Frankly, I don't think any writer is in a position to whine about information that they are being given, often for free, and often in people's spare time.

Moreover, while agents might differ when it comes to certain details of what they want from a prospective client, there are still obvious no-nos that they all do agree on, and even knowing what they are is extremely helpful.

With regards to bitterness, I can't see why that word offends you so much. If you don't believe that some writers are bitter about not being published, there is no shortage of comments on most writing blogs from crazed people who are barely literate and whose remarks are little more than an outpouring of vitriol about how their meisterwerk hasn't been published, not because they're awful writers, but because agents suck and don't know real brilliance when they see it. There are a million bitter, failed writers out there, and that bitterness colours their judgement on a grand scale. I see evidence of this on writers' blogs and forums on an almost daily basis.

If you've ever seen a TV talent show, you'll have seen that terrible, terrible singers who cannot carry a tune to save their lives audition time and time and then blame the judges, the audience and the producers, not their own obvious lack of talent, when they're rejected. There are plenty of bad writers who react to a rejection in much the same way - they think it's the agent's fault for not recognising greatness, or they think it's because their manuscript was in the wrong font, or they were given the wrong advice, or that the publishing world is snobbish and narrow-minded. What they don't do is recognise that their work is appalling.

I think there's plenty of info out there. The problem is that it conficts. I didn't have time to read all the other comments so this may be redundant, but I've researched the process for months, and found that some agents prefer queries one way, others another. Some resources say use a cover later not a query. Some resources say keep your query vague, others say tell the crux of the story. Then, there's all sorts of etiquette on follow ups with agents. It's not that the info isn't there. It's just confusing.Now, there's all whole new world of eBooks vs. publishing rights on printed books. Gee whiz I can't wait til I finally get one so he/she can help me make sense of it all! :)

Rachelle,

I've often commented to my husband how amazed I am that our society as a whole is so uninformed when there is such a wealth of information available. It's almost as if just knowing it's there gives us the 'comfort' to let it go until later.

That doesn't seem to have much to do with the situation you're commenting on, since you're talking about people who devour information and never seem to get enough.

But I think they do go together.

And I think part of the problem - possibly a large part of the problem - is that we've gone soft on critical thinking (the ability to see that if A equals B and B equals C, then A equals C).

That loss leads almost directly to an inability to digest and use the information we receive. Consequently, we take in information, but never satisfy our hunger by being able to digest it. The hunger to understand remains, so we 'eat' more.

I grew up on a dairy farm. Most of what I learned in childhood I learned from farming, not school. I learned to do as well as learn and I learned that I don't have to know everything there is to know about something before I do it. Painting is like that. I taught myself.

Writing is like that. I was writing stories before I knew anything about POV, voice, message, plot, structure or any of it.

What I see around me is a loss of that attitude. Now, we have to have our Garmin or Nuvee before we leave on a trip.

We have to check the weather before we step out the door.

We have to have all our ducks in a row before we venture out on any adventure.

Real life is not like that.

Neither is writing.

For myself, I know that if I spend too much time reading how to write, I tend not to write and am consequently looking for more information to help me get started.

Seeking information is good; but it has to be digested and it has to be used or it's just one sweet treat in a long series of sweet treats. Tasty while we partake of them, but of no lasting value.

Carrie L. Lewis

Joanne, the first two paragraphs of your rebuttal is certainly true. The writing MUST be great. I considered that to be a given. Of course you have to be knowing of your craft and write the best you can, BTW, I haven't even sent my first query, yet. I want my book to be as perfect as I can get it before I query.

The question here was - is there TMI about querying and publishing? That comes after learning the craft and the great writing.

I don't believe Rachelle asked this question to create negative responses, but to collect a myriad of OPINIONS from every corner of the writing community. It does not need to be a "You're right, I'm wrong" type of dialogue. I haven't read every single comment, but yours had an accusatory tone to it and I don't believe that was the point of this post.

I certainly appreciate the blogs and sites that offer their knowledge about everything to do with writing, I've learned so much from them and will continue to learn from them. I am only pointing out that there is much contradictory information about the subject at hand.

I don't agree with your analogy of the talent show. I guess I don't look at my writing as a competition. I look at it as something I love to do. Maybe I will become a good or great writer and maybe, I won't. The only one I'm competing with is myself.I guess that's why I don't feel that accusations of being bitter are called for in this situation.

If I offended you by calling you out on your comment, I apologize. But my opinions are just that, mine.

Dear Rachelle,

It all boils down to personality, persistence and tolerance. Those are the things that will get a writer through, over or away from the process. There is a plethera of information. Yes you can become overwhelmed. Nevertheless, you control the amount. Wise up, shut up and get off the agents back. I'm so frustrated at writers these days. The amount of truly great agents and their time is not in grand supply. How about we quit bombarding them with useless questions that we could find on goggle with our on engergies so they can put more energy into reading queries and responding.
Sorry that's just me thinking out loud as well Rachelle.

@Cynthia

There was nothing accusatory about my post at all. You chose to read it that way. As you say, opinions were requested, and I offered mine: I don't think there is too much information out there, but I do think lots of people are horribly over-reliant on it.

That opinion is just as valid as yours. You can't 'call me out' on my opinion and dismiss it as accusatory, invalid and negative and then expect to have your own go unchallenged. Your opinion is yours, as you say. But if you accept that, then you really do need to accept that mine is also mine, that it's apparent negativity doesn't make it invalid or inappropriate, simply because you don't like it.

Or are you saying that only 'positive' opinions have any validity? And that there are no bad writers or bitter people in the world, and that if they are, we have to pretend they don't exist?

Regarding talent shows, the competition aspect of it is completely irrelevant to the analogy. I didn't refer to writers competing with others, and that's certainly not how I see writing. I referred to bad writers offering their work to be judged by agents/publishers on its own merits, and then refusing to believe that the reason for their rejection is that insufficient merits ever existed. How is that different from a bad singer asking to be judged by a producer/record company exec/whatever on the quality of their singing, and then refusing to believe that the reason for their rejection is that the quality of their singing is abysmally low?

I am really baffled that you could be offended by an acknowledgement that some writers are terrible. That is simply an indisputable fact. How is that 'accusatory'?

I agree with those who believe there is too much information and that much of it is in response to the massive crush of writers - either new or old - wanting to get published. Many of us, myself included, who are not greatly competitive are intimidated by this great number and seek to gain whatever advantage we can. Trouble is, we're all seeing the same thing with the result of little or no advantage to anyone. Being right back where I started before doing all this research has discouraged me to the point of nearly giving up. I'm not sure where I will go from here.

Hi Rachelle, I used to read your and others' blogs very carefully and eagerly in order to learn, but now I just glance through once a week or so, for that exact reason. The information is good and useful, but I feel I know all I need to know at this particular point in my career and more information would just blow things out of proportion.

I actually do feel like there's a lot of temptation to blow things out of proportion - increased stress, increased self-importance, increased controversy, etc. - because of the enormity of information available.

Oh, and a question for you... do you get tired of writing about the same things on your blog over and over? Do you enjoy writing dozens of blogs about good-and-bad-queries, or does it drive you nuts? (I've been wondering that for a while.)

In reference to this statement....

"Or are you saying that only 'positive' opinions have any validity? And that there are no bad writers or bitter people in the world, and that if they are, we have to pretend they don't exist?"....

No! I am simply saying that opinions are opinions and do not have to be argumentative. Which is what you seem to want to do. I find that unprofessional.

In reference to this statement....

"I am really baffled that you could be offended by an acknowledgement that some writers are terrible. That is simply an indisputable fact. How is that 'accusatory'?".......

I guess I find the words you use a little brash and angry. I agree that some writers query before they are ready to query. And are disappointed when they learn their MS still needs work. That is part of the learning process. 'Terrible' and 'bitter' aren't the words I would use. Maybe, 'inexperienced' and 'disappointed' is how I would coin them.

I am in no way blaming agents or publishers for not publishing the work of inexperienced writers. Just that all writers must start somewhere. It's all part of the process. I feel from you that you might not be very supportive in the writing community. I don't recognize your name. I don't know if you are on the NYB list, but with your arrogance, I would never buy one of your books.

Sorry, BTW, my last comment was directed to Joanne Sheppard, in case anyone is wondering.:-)

@Cynthia,

Of course writers have to start somewhere. Where did I say otherwise? My point was simply that I think that too much and/or conflicting information from experts is probably the very last thing that is going to harm a writer's chance of being published, and that therefore by focusing on it (or worse, complaining about) is disproportionate and illogical, as the main reason that books don't get published is simply their quality.

Neither did I once make any generalisation about all unpublished writers. I referred to a particular type of bad writer who refuses to accept that they are bad, and looks for people to blame. Whether you choose to believe it or not, there are plenty of those people about. I didn't say that all inexperienced, disappointed are angry and bitter. I said that some of them are. If you refuse to believe that there is a single angry, bitter failed writer out there, then you've obviously never read their posts on blogs like this or other forums. I've read blogs from other lit agents who have actually reproduced the emails they've received from such writers when they've rejected them. Believe me, there are angry and bitter writers around. As I said, that is simply a fact. Not all failed writers are angry and bitter. Not even most of them. But some of them are. I fail to see anything offensive or arrogant in acknowledging that fact. If I'd said that my own writing was great, that would be arrogant. But I didn't. I didn't say a thing about myself. Nowhere did I assert that I am a published writer, either, so I don't see what that's got to do with it or why you need to bring it up. I've never queried an agent in my life because my book isn't even close to being at that stage yet. And of course you don't know my name. Why on earth would you? And as for the 'writing community', there is no one single 'writing community' in which everyone knows each other, and I don't see writing as something which requires 'support' or any obligation to join some sort of community. Again, I'm not really seeing the relevance of any of that to Rachelle's post or the opinion I expressed in response to it. What assumptions you want to make about me as an individual are entirely your own affair, but are hardly likely to be accurate given the minimal evidence on which you can base them. If you want to know the truth rather than guessing, I've been writing for a living ever since I graduated from uni 12 years ago, because my salaried day job is copywriting, but no, I've never had a novel published, nor am I under any illusions that I'm ready for that yet.

If you don't like my tone, then there isn't much I can do about that. I'm not angry in the least. I simply made my point directly, without making any personal attacks on a single individual, and expressed my opinion in answer to Rachelle's question. Apparently that has offended you. So be it. But if you are going to be offended, at least be offended by the things I actually said, rather than the things you merely *think* I said.

I actually think that we are being immensely rude by having this debate on someone else's blog, so I would rather it stopped now. I have said my piece, you have said yours. Let's do Rachelle the courtesy of not clogging up her Comments with our bickering any more, as I feel that we're both at fault on that score.

I will agree with you on this one, Joanne. We obviously let the claws out for whatever reason.

I think an apology is due to Rachelle and her commentors; however, I can't help thinking she and they will all have a good chuckle over it.:-)

I am grateful for every person in the business who is willing to come alongside via books, blogging, and mentoring. I glean all that I can and then ask the Author and Finisher of my faith to tell me what to do with it.

Six years later, doors are opening for me, and I am not overwhelmed by a to-do list. I am prepared and overwhelmed with joy! We write and speak to serve others.

There's masses of info out there and I think there's a time in the writing process to research whatever stage you're up to. There's also a time to stop, otherwise you read basically the same stuff over and over from a slightly different perspective.

I solved the different options for what to put in a querie letter and what not to by following the individual guidelines for whoever I was submitting to.

I find reading the personal experiences of other writers very heart warming. It's amazing how much support and good advice about the writing life ( including dealing with all this) that you can get from other writers on the path to publication.

I think there's a plethora of great information if you're knowledgeable about the right blogs to follow, but what frustrates me is when I read on one blog that all it takes is writing a great book and query. Then another blog says I have to have an outstanding platform and become a video director, painter and publicist because of the rise of book trailers and picture-friendly technology coming soon in e-books.

I recently went to the hugest craft store I've ever seen; it was awesome (in the true sense of the word)! Thanks to a very favorable exchange rate, everything was dirt cheap. I could almost buy one of everything if I had really wanted to!

My first 20 minutes were spent in total amazement. In the next 5 minutes I started to zone out and get numb. By 40 minutes I was feeling totally overwhelmed. After an hour I was feeling physically sick and had to get out of there and was glad when my friend said she was ready to go.

Initially I had just wanted to find some 'pretty ribbon', but faced with an entire warehouse room of ribbon I was at a loss of where to begin, how to decide which ribbon was most likely to be used, which worked with fabrics I already had, etc.

This is pretty much exactly how I feel about the internet. It can be great, but unless I have self-control and know how to be targeted in my searches (and determining who are the reliable and appropriate-for-me sources), it's pointless and overwhelming.

It's fantastic that the web is there and so much information is at hand for writers. Finding the best advice on many things is very time consuming, the best information I find is on dedicated blogs from those actually doing it.
An Industry now exists to service the would-be writer. Writers sometimes make the mistake that their first look into something is truth. That the google rank suggests it's the best to be had.
It is not.

From my own point of view there was a time that i thought first draft was was completed work. Tough lesson that one!
It's a learning experience for every writer, each journey will be different in the route it takes.

Hoe genuine is the guildance offered by some. Only time will tell. So many writers lose the will to write when they have to set about the process of submitting. It's a tough environment for the faint of heart.

Send what's asked for hasn't worked for me since i started submitting my first novel. 12 months of sweat and tears , editing with people, copy edits, proofreads have not got me one invitation to read the entire manuscript.
What do you do differently then when most of the information is DON'T DO IT ?

I had a few knowledgeable people read it over. All said they'd buy this book and i asked them to be unkind. It's the only way I know how to keep improving.

To study a charachter in a coming-of-age-tale means starting at the beginning of that journey, which is usually a time when the charachter realises somethings not quite right. To explore that in the beginning and remain honest to that, may be not enough to get prospective agent to ask for more. That's the worry I have right now and I can't find answers to that.

Someone said put it out into the world and let them decide. I like to write and hope my time for that in any given day will far outweigh the time I spend promoting. That's my dream. Only time will tell where it will eventually lead. I'm glad I'm doing it though. So may don't.

There is more than enough information out there, but as media consumers, we don't have the best skills at weeding out the best from the overload of information offered.

Why do people write you with basic questions? Because they see you as a trustworthy source of information. How can they depend on what a random blogger said? (besides, you've made the Writer's Digest list three years running, and that adds credibility!).

I believe as writers, we need to cultivate a balance in our lives. Reading every blog and writing book will not make us better writers. We may end up more informed, but we'll have less of our own writing out of our heads and down on paper.

Just as we need balance in everyday life, we should pick a few blogs and books to read, then get down to the business of writing. Developing a filter on our reading about writing may be one of the most valuable skills for the future.

I think there's plenty of information out there for writers concerning the publishing industry. I think the problem is what you said: people want there to be one right answer for one questions - they want definitive, but that won't happen because each source has a different opinion and a different method. I think the best anyone can do is what you said: write the best possible book you can, and go from there. No one is ever going to write a 100% perfect query letter. I've never written one, but I would think your query letter needs to be just as honest as the book you're trying to sale.

131 comments so far, so this might be too much information for you, but I don't think there's too much or too little information. There just is information, and you have to go through it and see what's there and needs to be learned and used. That's all

Wow, there are a lot of comments already, and you might have stopped reading. :-)

I don't think it has anything to do with the amount of information available, comprehensive, transparent, thorough, or not.

I think it has to do with the general frustration among writers trying find something objective in a subjective medium.

In life, we're taught that 1 + 1 = 2. If we follow a map, we'll get to our destination. If you refer to this flowchart, here, you'll find out whether you have appendicitis or an upset stomach.

When we submit and are met with rejection, it's so tempting to say, "Well, that agent just wasn't clear about what she wanted! If that other agent hadn't said to put the word count at the start of the query, I would have put it at the END, and then I would have gotten a full request, for SURE."

I think the bottom line is that people seek an outlet for blame. It's human nature to look outside ourselves to find a reason for our failures.

I wish people would stop diagnosing their failures this way. It's such a waste of time. Time that could be spent writing a better novel, or playing with our children, or finding a new place to eat ice cream. It's futile. It's negative energy. It needs to go.

I have an agent. She's fantastic. She signed me last year and she's an amazing fit.

That manuscript? It didn't sell.

I could sit here and belabor the point about why. But what good would that do? It didn't sell. We all tend to get so wrapped up in whose fault it was. Who cares? First off, if my novel doesn't sell, there's only one person to blame: me. ME. I wrote it. I put those words on paper. If it didn't sell, it wasn't the right time, the right story, the right whatever.

The point isn't to look for things or people to blame.

The point is to keep writing. To keep getting better. To keep looking forward.

Anything less is like sitting in the driver's seat with your foot on the accelerator, forgetting to put the car in gear.

It feels like you're moving, but really? You're not going anywhere.

I quit reading agent blogs except for three. Most of those were either frustrated writers or little more than PR. One Pez tells everyone what song is playing in her office. How does that help anyone? Why would we care?
Don't get me started on the tone of most "comments."

I think lots of writers simply become hoarders of information, desperate for the most detailed and specific "how-to"s. And that desperation is unpleasant.

For example: I horde books. Shamelessly. And yet, when I walk into Borders and am greeted by the seemingly infinite number of books, I feel overwhelmed. For the most part, buying books is fun (as is reading publishing info), but there are still moments when I get weary. It's endless, and endlessness is not something we naturally like. It makes me exhausted just thinking about how many books are within a 100 foot radius.

What we need to learn to do is withstand. Stop subscribing to 1000 industry blogs. There's no way we're going to find time for them or process all the info. There's no way we're going to be able to make sense of the multiple views on the same 20 topics. So, in the long run, it's all about self-discipline. And not being afraid of the truth: It's endless, and you'll never have the time.

Do you also have to pay for say a title of a book or a movie you mentioned in your novel?

Interesting stuff. I reference the song, 'Hey Jude' in one of my novels although I don't mention the Beatles or reference lyrics. Would I still have to pay permissions?

Wow, really interesting.

I guess most writers just assume that all those costs are covered by the publishers.

And CFD, I think that mentioning a title is free, and you don't need permission for that.

But don't quote me on that, I could be wrong.

Rachelle,

Thanks for this post! It's one I haven't seen covered before.

On the subject of permissions: I'd like to know more about getting permissions to use poetry when the book it comes from is long, long out of print--but still in copyright. I would hope it would be less expensive?

:-)

This is a very helpful post, Rachelle. Thanks. I have one quote from a classic novel in my book which I'm going to go back and delete now.

One word. Bummer.

How's that for honesty?

I'm writing a book. I don't like to have to think about this in the midst of the creative process. I mean, I REALLY don't like it.

The cost of every #@%&! reference to something should not nag at me or affect the artist process. It shouldn't! Okay, I'm not shouting. I'm just a bit worked up. It's early in the morning and I need some strong coffee. At least, I wasn't planning to use song lyrics or cartoons . . .

I'm so glad I have an agent who is on top of these things. :)

Wow. An index? I had no idea. Thanks for the informative post.

I'm curious on the use of song lyrics where one crosses the line between "fair use" and rights infringement.

For example, if a character starts humming a song, I assume naming the song and/or group causes no problem. If they burst into a single phrase of the song (probably from the chorus) has the line been crossed?

~ Jim

Of course there is also that wonderful but fuzzy doctrine of fair use that is defined more by court cases than by copyright law. When in doubt, it’s best to get permission, but when we’re disagreeing with someone’s position, that person may not want to give us permission at any price. That doesn’t necessarily mean that we can’t quote that person.

And to those people concerned about the use of names and book titles, consider that copyright law applies as much to things like blog post and for that matter the comments to blogs as it does to a published book. I would suggest looking at this with a bit of commonsense. Can you imagine if we had to get permission to mention the name of a book every time we wanted to list the books we’re reading? I would say that we would have to e-mail the copyright holder, but we couldn’t because it would be illegal to mention the book in the e-mail.

The point is that copyright law is not intended to limit free speech but is supposed to be a protection for writers like us. It isn’t there to protect us from things we don’t want people to say about us, but to protect us from them taking our work and reducing our ability to make money from it.

In the current era of "narrative sampling," etc. (I'm thinking of the young German author who was in the news a few months ago), I am glad for stringent copyright/permissions laws. It should not come as a shock to any seasoned writer that you would have to pay permissions fees for lyrics, poems, photos, etc.

It comes up often on my various writers loops about permissions for song lyrics. We know you need to get permission and probably that we need to pay for it (actually, the talk is usually: the publisher will handle it, and it ends there), but it is a constant question, usually beginning with the HOW of the process. It seems to be an issue for the smaller presses and their authors.

If you could talk about that, this music junkie would be quite grateful.

One solution is to write your own poetry and songs, or use something in the public domain.

What about references used in non-fiction books? As in historical or scientific sources- you don't have to pay for using their book as a source do you?

Cassandra Frear, during the creative process all you really need to be concerned with is making sure you properly identify the source of all your quotes—book name, author(s), page numbers, publisher, etc.—which you would need to do anyway, copyright or no copyright. It’ll save you time later if you’ll also record the e-mail address and/or mailing address for the copyright holder, but after the creative stuff is done is the time to worry about obtaining permission. At that time, you just need to send letters to each copyright holder identifying the material you would like to copy and asking for their terms. There’s work involved, but nothing so difficult that it should stifle the creative process.

Hmm. This brings up an interesting question (albeit lousy timing). I have quoted some famous movie lines in a recent book. When I asked my editor about it, she said she didn't think it would be an issue. Now I'm wondering if that's the case and perhaps I have something new to feel anxious about. :-)

Titles are not copyrightable - you could call you next masterpiece "The Sun Also Rises" without being sued. (What bookstores and readers would think is something else again). You could even have a (fictional) character disparage "A Farewell To Arms" without getting into trouble. If you were writing non-fiction and claimed Hemingway did not really write it, you might have problems (unless you could prove it).

When I need a bit of poetry or song lyrics for chapter headings or in the text, I simply write it myself. Are there novelists out there who can't/don't write poetry?

Interesting! I've always been fascinated by the index thing. A well done index makes me jump for joy. And I've also gnashed my teeth over some poorly done indexes in books. Who are the mysterious people who do indexing anyway and how do they do it?

Am I familiar with this post?!?! Oh yes, the song lyrics at the top of each chapter. My book idea self-destructed after this one. Thank you so much for your help & direction on this one!!

No book ideas in the works for me. My love of music was my inspiration, and I hope to perculate a new idea at some point. But for now, just enjoying learning the ropes. Thanks for all your write.

Interesting questions posted here. I am eager to see the answers.

CFD: You never need permission to mention a title of anything - song, book, movie, whatever. They are not subject to copyright. That's why you see books and even movies of the same name.

T. Anne: You can reference a song without getting permission. It's the lyrics that matter.

Anonymous 1:56 AM: Ack! Don't delete your quote! I never said anything in this post about quoting from another BOOK. It's totally different, and as long as your quote isn't pages and pages long, it most likely won't require either permission or payment. I'll be more specific in my later post.

Cassandra Frear: Are we all over-reacting today or what? I didn't say "worry about every little reference to something." I said QUOTE FROM A SONG OR POEM. Or Use somebody's artwork or photo. That's very different from referencing something.

This is not about "mentioning something." It's about using somebody's intellectual property. Chill out, girl!

Jim 4:36 AM: Look at it this way. If you quoted 100 words from a 100,000-word novel, that would be one-tenth of one percent of the entire work. It's a very small portion, and can be considered a "fair use." But it you quote just 2 lines from a 10-line song, you're now using a full 20% or one-fifth of the work - a very large portion of it. That's not "fair use" and the songwriter deserves credit and possibly, payment.

(Please note that "Fair Use" is not a fully spelled out rule or doctrine, there is no specified word limit, and it is open to wide interpretation.)

Susan 5:35 AM: The "how" of getting permissions is complicated but in this day and age, everyone has Google and a phone. You have to find out the copyright holder, get on your computer and track it down.

Suz Rocks: You're talking about Fair Use. Just make sure you're not using more than about 200 words from a single source and you should be fine. The rules are fuzzy and your publisher will give you their guidelines.

Sandra 6:08 AM: A movie is more like a novel and can be quoted without permission with the same guidelines above - make sure you're not quoting half the movie in your book.

BK Jackson: Um, they're called "indexers." They use a variety of means of indexing - some use indexing software and some don't - but I don't think I can give you a full course on indexing here in the comments, sorry.

Thanks, Rachelle! Very interesting and helpful, as I was curious about this point because in my YA contemporary fantasy novel, I mention the titles of numerous 80s songs during a themed homecoming dance. Question, though: What about things like restaurant names or stores?

Thank you!!

You don't need permission to mention a name of anything. People, brands, restaurants, stores, books, movies, songs, anything.

People and businesses have NAMES so that people can USE those names. It's not something that requires permission.

Something some people may not realize is that the most commonly used Bible translations (other than the KJV) are still under copyright and require copy permission. Many include a page spelling out what is allowed. Usually it is along the line of you can quote from it with proper reference given, but you can’t quote large amounts (more than 500 verses for NIV) or have the quotes make up more than some percentage of the work without explicit permission.

This post was interesting and to the point. Thanks for the information. I had often wondered about what did and did not require special permission to be used. Now I know.

Thanks for the insight.

Wow, I didn't know that. I learned something new today, and the day just started. Thanks for the great post.

Oh my goodness! Maybe I'll rethink having a bit of Frank Sinatra in my current WIP. It's not much, though the song may be in the public domain--I'd have to check.

Yikes! I need to keep this in mind! Thanks for sharing!

As a journalist, I understood you could use approx. 50 words from an article and 250 from a book. That's what I used when quoting sources in my articles. Still valid?

A few years back I used the title and lyrics of the chorus Famous One to conclude my novel, uh, The Famous One. Per 1000 copies, the cost to use the lyrics was $40 (which I paid for). I think it's a bit more now.

Probably a silly question, but what about (old) folk songs with no known author? Can the artists who recorded specific versions of the song claim copyright, or music historians who recorded them in books? Or are these pieces truly public domain?

I found some questions from an online self-help article that I wanted to use in my novel. I emailed the company through their contact page, sent them a certified letter, called their 800 number which sent me in circles, even posted on their facebook page asking for permission and no one ever responded--this has gone on for months. What can you do if you've done your due diligence in attempting to get permission but the requestee doesn't respond?

I enjoy reading this blog and coming away with answers to questions I didn't even know I had!

It's bonus knowledge!

Thanks for the post, Rachelle. I have never seen this addressed anywhere, whether in blog or book. Good to educate authors on these points, which could be very important.

Thanks for the post, Rachelle. I have never seen this addressed anywhere, whether in blog or book. Good to educate authors on these points, which could be very important.

Thank you for sharing this information.

~ Angela

This post was most helpful. I did a bit of research into this as I want to include a line from a Disney movie which is also a lyric in a song. Disney and many others use a company (www.HalLeonard.com) to handle all these requests, and they said that my work needed to be closer to publication before they could consider the request. They have a Frequently Asked Questions page on their website which is very helpful.

Rachelle, as you said, all you need is Google and a phone (and I'd add an email address), and you can find out much of what you need to know.

Thanks again!

@Rachelle: Thank you for addressing my question! That helps tons.

Rachelle,
This was such an useful post! Thank you! It was news to me that it is the author's responsability to pay for these additions. I'd be interested in reading more about using lyrics in the contemporary Christian music genre. How expensive are those? How about if there would be an accompanying CD of the quoted songs? I'm willing to pay some but there's a limit what I can do. Any help would be appreciated. Thank you!

helpful post! I'm in the process of trying to clear quotes for my novel, and I have my fingers crossed it won't cost me so much that I have to take the quotes out!

Wow, I never thought about this. Thank you for sharing this information. And the Bible is copyrighted, hadn't thought of that either.

This is very intresting, and something I think many new authors don't consider. I'm in the midst of final edits of a novel for a small publisher, and found out the hard way how difficult permissions can be to obtain. If the song is popular and not in the public domain, heaven help you. I ended up excising the single line I used in a chapter and even dropping the few song titles I mentioned to avoid any risks. Not famous, not rich (though someday, I hope!)... can't afford to pay for words that aren't mine.

Okay, so an index is a pretty standard thing that most of us realize people using a book for research will want, so it really shouldn’t come as a surprise when the publisher asks for one, but suppose we’ve signed the deal, taken the $1,200 of the top and it looks like we’ll make it until the publisher comes along and says, “You know what? What would really make this book great is a picture of a kitty cat at the first of every chapter. And we need chart correlating the data from the TPS reports. And I saw this great Dilbert cartoon that would go great on page 56. Oh, by the way, my niece is a great artist and needs money for college. We should put some of her work in here.” At what point does the author have the option of saying, “Look, if you want it in there, you pay for it!”

And I have another question. You said that the publisher would take the $1,200 out of royalties. Suppose the advance is $30,000, of which we would expect the agent to get $4,500. Suppose the book doesn’t earn out. Is the agent’s cut calculated on the original $30,000, on $28,800 because the author wasn’t paid the $1,200, or on $31,200 because the publisher advanced the index on top of the original advance?

Eeeek.
thanks for the help.
Good to know.

I've been using a Procul Harum lyric as inspiration / a working title on a novel.

I had a feeling I might be changing it when I'm finished. This confirms it. Love the lyric, but not that much. ;)

@rachelle, thanks for the post. I've a short story where I quote a line from a CS Lewis book. It seems that is okay, since it was only a couple lines of a book, but I'm curious -- when do copyrighted works expire and enter the public domain? I've heard different responses to this.

@timothy, I believe (and someone correct me if I'm wrong) that if the publisher says they'll take it out of the royalties, that's what the author is paid from profits of the book selling, and does NOT include the advance.

I'd also guess that if it's the publisher that insists on adding photos, cartoons, etc., it's the publisher that will pay for them. Usually, however, it's the author that adds them.

Rachelle, great information. Thanks for posting it.

Luke Evans: Copyright is currently author's life plus seventy-five years. I believe.

Luke Evans, the advance is just an advance on royalties, so from the publisher’s perspective, the advance and the indexing fee are both coming out of the same bucket. The question arises because it isn’t clear whether the publisher will pay the full advance and then add an addition advance to pay for the indexing or if the publisher will pay the author the advance less the $1,200 the author owes the publisher. Then the agent adds another level of confusion because the author never actually sees the $1,200 because the published has paid the author in services. Because it is part of the royalties, we assume the agent is entitled to her cut. Had the book earned out, we could take the sum of the royalties and multiply by 15%, but since it didn’t we only have the advance. Assuming the publisher paid the full advance and also paid the $1,200 from royalties, the author/agent team have received a check for $30,000, but the publisher’s records show a $31,200 advance. Because the $1,200 is supposed to come out of the author’s pocket, the agent is justified in claiming 15% of the $1,200, but because the author never saw the $1,200 the agent would be taking money out of the author’s pocket by doing so. While there may not be a “right” answer here, it seems like there is a different best answer depending on if you are a writer, an agent or a publisher.

US Copyright law, as I understand it, is such that everything published before 1923 is in public domain. Anything published between 1923 and 1977 may go into public domain as many as 95 years after the publication date. After 1978, the greater of life plus 70 years and 12-31-2047, unless the author is a company, in which case the copyright is good for up to 120 years from the creation date or 95 years from the publication date.

This is seriously useful stuff! Thank you very much, Rachelle!

Thank you, Rachelle. And thank you, public domain.

My big question is using music in books and classes. I need to research a non-commercial license for using music in classes. But using lines from songs in books...wow...maybe $200?? I love lyrics, but that is a lot to pay. What I think would be cool is to work with a songwriter to write your own songs and lyrics. Any ideas?

Rachelle, thanks for another great post. You are a wealth of information.

This is an issue that has been stressing me out recently. In my blog, I love to quote various song lyrics. I always credit the lyricist, give the title, etc.

Recently I used some lyrics from the musical Les Miserables as part of a personal story; a certain song in the musical really changed my thinking, and I had to quote a number of lines to really drive home my point.

Was I supposed to get permission to do this? Pay $$? Or was this "fair use"?

If I have to get permission to use the lyrics in a simple blog post, that really makes me feel inhibited in what I can post and is highly inconvenient; after all, a blog post is really supposed to be a relatively quick thing to write! But I also want to give credit where credit is due and do the legal/moral thing.

This is why I write fiction--and fiction that isn't quirky enough to need an index. Or a verse from a Paul Simon song. (Okay, I did use one of the latter in a novella I wrote in high school. Didn't publish it, though.)

Great post. Thank you. What about quotes if you give credit to the author of the quote?

Rachelle,

I apologize for seeming to be so touchy. I wasn't as upset as I sounded. I meant it half-jokingly, but I realize now that I didn't come across that way.

I won't rant here again. You have my word on it. This was very unprofessional of me.

Thank you for your patience,

Cassandra

Interesting discussion here! I have never used song lyrics, until this recent book, and then I've put in a few "old mountain songs or hymns" lyrics - and boy did I do some research - finding I'd feel most comfortable with things written in the 1800 or very early 1900's, and then, those with so many varied versions, the original was hard to find.

Of those, some were re-recorded by "famous people" like the Carters and Cash and Dylan, but, they don't own the copyright -that's how I understand it - they didn't write the lyrics, some one in the 1800's or 1900's did, so I am "safe" using them - even so, it's daunting to use song lyrics, there's always that uncomfortable edgy feeling, which is why I normally never would use them.

I have quoted pieces of books - Tom Sawyer, To Kill a Mockingbird, with no problem- just a few lines is all.

Using Shakespeare and Ovid quotes is fair use - far as I know - fair use ...etc

On the subject of what author's pay for: I know that many authors, even those in the Big 6 arena, have to pay for their traveling expenses in most cases . . .

And last, many people do not know that authors have to buy copies of their own books - we do get some copies upon pulication, but, after those are gone, we purchase our books-at a discount, but we still purchase them, and we don't receive royalties on books we purchase ourselves, of course . . . don't know if these things are "across the publisher board" or not.

Great Discussion!

Lauradroege, fair use is not clearly defined, so even a lawyer (which I am not) may have trouble giving you a clear idea of what it is and is not. There are a number of factors involved. One is how much of the original work you copied, but another is how much of the new work is actually new work and how much is from the original work. As an extreme example, suppose someone copied a paragraph from a book. In amount copied it would probably fall under fair use, but if the only new work is a statement, “Enough said!” then it may not be considered fair use because the blog is just using the content rather than saying something that needs the material to support it.

Who said blog posts are supposed to be convenient and quick to write? Writing is writing and that includes obtaining proper permission. It may be inconvenient, but it will save time and money later if we don’t have to go to court.

Kathryn Magendie, the works of Shakespeare and Mark Twain are in the public domain, so you could have copied the whole original piece and not needed to obtain permission. Of course, one should still give proper credit or it is plagiarism, which is taboo even when it isn’t illegal.

I may not have been clear in what I just said. Fair use and public domain are two very different concepts. Things in the public domain are all those thing that do not have legal copyright protection for any of various reasons. Fair use has more to do with the concept of freedom of speech. While copyright protection is important in order for authors to make money from their work, the use of copyright protection to silence those who disagree must never be allowed.

One way to save on index costs is to do it yourself if the publisher is willing. I have indexed 5 of my books and blogged about my adventures in indexing on my WordPress blog at http://bit.ly/d3XweB

It's not for everyone but works particularly well with smaller or niche publishers.

I've written two non-fiction books (#2 is currently undergoing the penultimate edit) and in both cases the publisher has taken care of the index. At no time was it mentioned that it would come out of my royalties. In fact this second book is work-for-hire and I will get no royalties - just an up front payment.

So in what case would the author have to pay for an index?

RedHeadedQuilter: In what case? Most cases.

Your work-for-hire experience doesn't count in this discussion since everything is different in a work for hire situation.

Your other book - all I can say is, lucky you that you weren't responsible for the index! Your publisher must have a different policy than most.

Timothy Fish- Thanks for weighing in on this. With the post quoting Les Mis, I used about 13 lines. When you consider how long the musical is, this is a pretty small percentage; the lyrics are used to back up what I'm saying and to show the effect it had on me. But I'm still not sure if this counts as "fair use".

So what do I do with the posts that have used song lyrics? Delete them? Try to pay for it now? It would be painful to have to delete the Les Mis one, because it really spoke to a lot of people. THoughts on this? TImothy? Rachelle? Anyone?

The index is normally covered in a contract clause. Mine required me to either prepare an index or ask the publisher to do so with the cost to be deducted from royalties. I did my own. That's not for everyone, but it worked out well and I'm glad for the experience.

We often hear there's more money and opportunity in nonfiction, but when you consider the cost of indexing, photo permissions, research (not that fiction doesn't require it also), greater impact of competition, and the need for platform, that's not always true.

Lauraroege, my take on it is that I first don’t post any under copyright unless I am confident that what I’m doing falls within fair use or I have obtained permission. If there are posts that you aren’t sure about, the easiest option is to delete the post, but since you don’t want to do that, I would first suggest looking at the fair use guidelines for the relevant copyright law. If you still aren’t sure, contact the copyright holder with a copy of the post(s) identifying the copied material and express that you believe it falls under fair use and would like to know if they disagree. It’s quite possible that they’ll say they have no problem with it. If that’s not the case, you may still have the opportunity to pay for the right to publish the material. If they disagree and don’t give you the opportunity to pay for the rights, your best option is going to be to remove the post unless you have desire to go hire an attorney to prove that your use of the material is fair use.

I have a question. I haven't read every comment, but I have read Rachelle's answers and I didn't see this one in there.

What about quoting song lyrics in a short story on a blog or some similar forum where the author of the story isn't being paid. Can the author still get in trouble for quoting those lyrics, or does it only come into play when the author sells that story?

I have several poems from a friend that I use throughout my novel. I have her permission to use them, but we've never discussed payment. Assuming some future deal, I'd like to be fair to her. What would fair look like?

A % of royalties? A certain $ amount? She's currently unpublished, but I'd like to think that after people read her poetry they'll want more...

Daniellelapaglie, that would be like stealing a diamond necklace from a jewelry store and telling the judge that you shouldn’t go to prison because you didn’t sell it. Instead of looking at what the offending party makes from the theft of copyrighted material, the courts tend to look more at how much money the copyright owner might have made, among other factors primarily related to damages to the copyright holder.

Thanks for the info, Tim. I guess I was considering it more like a cover band vs. a record deal. People can sing any song they want on stage, but if they try to record it and sell it, it's a whole different ball game. One is a tribute, and one is a theft.
- Danielle La Paglia

Daniellelapaglia, copyright law makes some special provisions for performances where money is not made directly or indirectly. And “the purpose and character of the use” is one of the things the courts are supposed to consider when evaluating fair use, but whereas the law states very clearly what performances are not copyright infringement, it is just a consideration when looking at fair use. While someone performing God Bless America at a veteran’s hospital isn’t likely to reduce the copyright owner’s ability to make money, making the words and music available for free on the Internet might.

When I have characters quoting the Bible, I've always gotten the quotes off BibleGateway.com, and since I know specific translations could still be copyrighted, I always picked the KJV quotes. Would I need permission from that site?

No

I think every endeavor needs a splash of cold water once in a while. While it can be encouraging to hear that agents are fighting over projects, it's also a clarion call to get to work making your writing the best it can be. Because if it's not a-one writing, you're not likely to be one of the authors agents duke it out over. (That's not to say an agent won't take you on if your writing isn't the best. You might get an agent who likes to revise and work with an author to polish the prose of an idea that grabs them.)

Before this comment goes on too long I think I'll stop. Thanks for this, Rachelle.

I'm glad to read 'reality checks'. They are necessary and helpful!

I can only liken this to when I had to through wads of resumes in search of the right employee for the job. When you go through enough resumes you really do gain the skill of being able sort the good from the bad without having to go through the interview process first.

Rachelle, thanks for this post. I'm not on twitter and I'm surprised to hear writers react this way. Sure, it's encouraging that agents are fighting over authors (even if it's a few), but more so, it's incentive to craft the best novel you can, being that the competition is tight and the best queries/samples/novels are getting all the attention. When I read Kristin's post, I thought: I'm going to work my butt off to push my writing and story to the next level, to step out of the sea of mediocre.

Brrrrr....*shiver*


:-) Hahaa. I saw Kristin's post. Thanks for that splash. *grin*

That picture is 100% hilarious.

I hadn't read that post yet, and considering the horrible hot flashes I've had lately in this muggy heat, the cold water felt good, ha!

I agree with the person about resume's, it's so frustrating going through a pile of awful or mediocre resumes and finding that gem... only to find out that they are considering an offer of employment elsewhere. But that surely doesn't mean the job market is improving because 2 companies hiring liked the same well-qualified person!!

If we were talking about the job market rather than agents, it would make sense. Multiple employers will only fight over a new employee if they all have openings for a new employee. After the dust settles, one of them will have hired him and the others will still be looking for someone to fill the vacancy. That is certainly good news for other job seekers.

With agents fighting over a client, it is likely to mean something else. Since the agent is actually the “employee” in this situation, it probably means there aren’t that many viable clients out there. This is a result of publishers being more selective. If publishers were less selective then agents would be less selective and the probability that they would select the same author would be reduced.

Dude. Sprinkler to the face = LOLZ. Great pic and post :)Thanks!

Thanks for the reality check and for the reminder that I can't just whip out my novel in a week and expect agents to fight over me. lol

Cold water is better than a vat of ice cubes. Thanks for the kinder, gentler reality check.

Rachelle, I'm grateful (and constantly amazed) that you chose me, even if there was no bidding war.

Thanks for the reality check.

=)

I wonder Kristin's observation also has to do with the fact (I think) that the market is getting more competitive, so writers are querying more agents simultaneously, casting a wider net than they used to. So the good projects end up getting responses from a lot of agents.

HAAAAAAA!

Perfect place to insert that photo.

I dare to disagree with your assertion. Many, many agents don't bother reading your full until you inform them of an offer-- THAT is how fights emerge. They suddenly say, "This might be interesting" because someone else is interested. I've been through this a couple times now, so I've seen it first hand. It's like when a guy dates a girl and his buddies suddenly realize she's hot, whereas before they didn't notice her at all. I don't think it's inherent merit to a project, necessarily.

While I appreciate the "helpful caveat", it's frustrating to see so many agents online suck up to editors in one breath and try to bring writers down to earth the next. I wonder how many are trying to pass off their own frustrations, just in case any of us got the idea for a second that this process was easy.

That makes sense. Thanks for the clarification!

I hadn't seen Jessica's post, so thanx. I doubt I'll be in the midst of bidding war, but I find the whole idea quite enchanting. ;)

Oh to be fought over:)I'll settle for a close finish any time.

Dittos to what Katie Ganshert and Dr. Mabry said :) My mouth is still agape with grateful amazement, so please don't turn the hose on me, or I'll catch a drowning mouthful.

Come on Rachelle. If water in the face was enough to drench our delusions of grandeur we wouldn't be in the writing business. Strike up the band. Bring out the dancing bears. Let the bidding commence!

Ha! Another great post, Rachelle. The photo is perfect. Thanks for continuing to pour out your knowledge and experience.

Question for you:

After a publishing house considered but eventually turned down one of my manuscripts, I decided to start pursuing agents rather than going the direct route because of the amount of time it was taking for me to research publishing houses on my own. (I usually spend the end of December and all of January, and part of February going through them and trying to find which will be the best choices to approach for the following year.) What I find is that although the agents respond quicker, they often ask for exclusive submissions. How would an author end up with competing agents if they can't submit to more than one at a time? Are these just well-known authors that agents are approaching? Also, do agents represent by the project or the author? Is an author able to send one manuscript to one agent and a different one to a second agent?

I disagree with the assertion that the reason that agents are interested is because other agents are interested. I submitted several manuscripts only to have one go to committee at several houses and get rejected (before I had an agent.) On the next round, I had my proposal go to several agents and get three offers of representation independent of one another. This is a great indicator that one ms. was close, and the next was on the money. It wasn't a case of a kid wanting a toy only because another kid wanted it. This is an industry filled with professionals who know what will sell. (But it does give me a secret sense of glee to know that a group who turned down one of my books because it didn't would never be more than a long article, now has asked me to work with them on another project. Insert evil giggle here...)

Thanks for the clarification...and for the laugh. That picture is awesome :)

This is a great perspective on the agent anger issue a lot of writers develop. Business is all about a personal assessment of saleability of a product (no matter what that product may be), and if an agent isn't interested in your work that's not their fault.

I also LOVE the picture in this post. Excellent.

I think it’s a pretty safe bet that agents are sometimes interested only after they learn that someone else is. I don’t know that there’s anything wrong with that. It’s a natural thing for people to do. For example, a person might turn his nose up at a certain kind of food, basing his opinion on the name or how it looks, but after hearing that someone else liked it, he might decide he wants to try it. We wouldn’t think anything about someone doing that, so why should it be an issue it an agent passed over a manuscript on an off day and decides to look at it again when she hears that her agent friends like it?

Michael K. Reynolds said, “if water in the face was enough to drench our delusions of grandeur we wouldn’t be in the writing business.” I think there’s something to that. And yet I think most of us are well aware of what we face. (Well, actually we don’t, but no one is willing to tell us.) The real question is why we keep going. We’ve set a goal and to get there we have to do something. Normally, when face with a situation like this we would reevaluate the situation and find a better way. That’s what our characters do, but in this situation any change in the system is rejected outright and many people have set goals that force them to go right through the cold water. When change isn’t acceptable, cold water is useless.

I agree w/ Anon 8:57 too cuz it happenend to me: Agents love to compete and win. Who doesn't? It's like the pack mentaility. Case in point: American Idol.
Casey James sounds great time after time, but they put him down--yet when Crystal sings the same old tune, they all go nuts.

When I told agents I had my full out with a few others, which was true, you can bet that sped up their reading from two months to two weeks. I almost accepted an offer, but it wasn't the right one so I revised and am now resubmitting. But it's taking twice as long to get responses so I'm back to square one. Frustrating!

This is exactly what I was thinking when I was reading some of the comments over there.

Hi Rachelle. Firstly, great post and valuable clarification. Thanks.

Secondly, I see you often answer questions from confused writers but I'm not sure how people usually go about posing questions. I didn't want to post a random comment on the blog "off topic", but this is kinda related to "saleability" so here goes...

I live in Canada and I am sending queries to U.S. agents, but my education and upbringing is British. My ms therefore uses British spelling throughout. Are agents likely to see this as a major issue, or a minor technicality to sort out later? Is this likely to be an obstacle to getting an offer of representation, or would I be advised to edit the manuscript to U.S. spelling before going any further?

Thanks for your mah-velous sense of humor. It keeps us going!

Question for you, Rachelle:

Does an agent represent one book by an author, or the author herself? The reason I would like to know is because I have a few manuscripts now that I’m looking for representation or homes for. It is ethical to send one to one agent but another to a different agent?

Thanks!

Question for you, Rachelle:

Does an agent represent one book by an author, or the author herself? The reason I would like to know is because I have a few manuscripts now that I’m looking for representation or homes for. It is ethical to send one to one agent but another to a different agent?

Thanks!

All men speculation, but not equally. Those who delusion not later than twilight in the dusty recesses of their minds, wake in the day to learn that it was bootlessness: but the dreamers of the hour are menacing men, for the duration of they may dissimulation on their dreams with open eyes, to get them possible.

The glory of great men should always be leisurely by way of the means they secure utilized to into it.

Thank you so much! These details are so helpful for figuring out our needs *before* we're in a position to start negotiating them.

Are you serious that authors are generally usually only interested in advance and royalty rates?

In your experience would agents be annoyed by authors taking interest in other areas of the contract? Is this kind of thing worth discussing with potential agents offering representation, or is it pretty much an industry-wide standard?

Great post! Thanks for sharing. I understood each point except remaindering. What's that? Sounds like a math problem. :)

Rachelle,
And, of course, all those details listed above only come into play after you've managed to sell the book in the first place.
To those people who say, "I don't need an agent," I would say, "Oh, yes you do. Maybe you don't know it, but you really do."
Thanks for sharing.

This is an excellent blog entry and it addresses an issue near and dear to my heart. I am an attorney and for many years I worked in-house for a large publisher. I believe that the vast majority of authors we signed to contracts did not read the entire contract before signing and, if they did, I doubt that there was full comprehension. Everyone should read every contract that they are asked to sign -- whether they are publishing contracts or contracts entirely unrelated to books and writing. More importantly, before signing a contract, it is important to understand what it means, whether that requires the engagement of an outside advisor (lawyer or agent) or not.

Aimee -- You should care about every word in the agreement, at least enough to understand what the agreement provides. You may not have the leverage to negotiate every point (and usually it is not necessary to delay the process by negotiating every point) but you should at least know what you are conceding.

Please note that the above should not be construed as legal advice and that by reading the above an attorney-client relationship is not established.

These aren’t major questions, but I’ve always been curious how many copies an author usually gets. Is there a typical amount? Also, with the option on future works, does that normally refer to sequels for a fiction writer?

Even though legalities aren’t my thing, reading through this is incredibly exciting.

~ Wendy

What a helpful post, Rachelle -- thanks so much!

Thanks for sharing a valuable, and detailed post. Just reinforces how indispensable an agent is to advocate on writer's behalf in the publishing world. Would be interested to read your thoughts on how new techology (ie e-books licensing) is being addressed in new contracts you're reviewing and how old contracts are being revised to address this.

One thing that will become more and more important, and to which authors and agents have not paid enough attention so far: publisher's policy re galleys. Major NY publishers now have a no-galleys-for-bloggers policy.

This sort of thing was not in place until recently and can seriously hamper the author's promotion. This is a point that authors and agents will be well advised to include in the contracts in the future.

Rachelle,
Thanks for addressing a very important issue! I have a question re "their work doesn't infringe on any laws..."

I wanted to open the first novel of my trilogy with the first verse of a popular song from 1945. I read somewhere that an author needs to obtain all permissions necessary to use another person's copyrighted works before even seeking an agent. When I e-mailed the agency that now owns the lyrics to this song to inquire about using the lyrics, the agency sent me a form asking how many copies of the book were to be published, etc, because their fee for usage of the lyrics is based on sales of the book.

If an author wishes to use a copyrighted lyric, poem, paragraph, or even a previously published quote, is that permission negotiated by the agent or by the publisher? If it is the author's responsibility, was I going about it the wrong way?

Thanks again and God bless,

Angela

I was actually just thinking about this the other day, so I'm glad you posted it. Thank you! :]

What an interesting and helpful post, Rachelle. Reading this post should help all writers realize just how important having an agent is to a writer. Thanks!!

This is so great! I was overwhelmed when I first saw my contract and was very thankful I had a great agent watching out for me. All these things can be so confusing. Thanks for sharing this!

This is so great! I was overwhelmed when I first saw my contract and was very thankful I had a great agent watching out for me. All these things can be so confusing. Thanks for sharing this!

Thanks so much for this. I'm (hoping) to get my first contract this week. This is a great overview.

Concerning Angela's question about copyright (from church music experience rather than legal advice), it seems to me that the best thing to do would be to pay the fees for the number of copies you need for sending your manuscript out to various people, whether it be to agents, publishers or your critique group. You would need only tell the publisher that copy permission can be obtained and what the fee is. The publisher can then make the determination of whether they want to pay that fee and publish the book. Since it is the publisher who will be making the copies, they are the ones who will need copy permission to publish the material in book form.

Succinct, clear, useful. Several elements I hadn't considered. Thank you.
.

Great information. I'm fascinated by this. I'm not sure this a major question, but I am curious about how many books actually go into hardback, and what is the difference between trade and mass market paperback. Thanx Rachelle.

Thanks for the helpful post Rachelle. What does an author need to know about "Right of first Refusal?"

T. Anne - From my understanding Trade is usually a little larger (think of a typical CBA bookstore book) and MM is a little smaller (think grocery store novel). Now, I'm sure there are plenty of other much more important distinctions but that's helped me start to get my mind around there being two different things called paperbacks. :-)

Rachelle - THANK YOU!!! I have been curious about what all goes into contracts! I'm one of those people that even reads the TOS before I go to websites so I definitely am curious about what all is going to be in a publishing contract! I'm so grateful that there are agents out there like you that can fully understand them and help us authors get the best one possible. I just can't imagine 10-15 pages of legalese and industry terms I don't know well and having to navigate it alone. Things like this make it seem unfathomable to me to think of jumping into publishing without an agent.

You continue to educate writers. Thank you.

Thank you very much for this post. I'm saving it for (hopefully) future reference.

If anyone has a question of why they should have an agent, might want to take a look at this list. Thank you Rachelle. It's a point point reason to have a champion on your side before trying to figure it out themselves.

@ T. Anne - Wendy Delfosse is pretty much spot-on. A TPB is a larger paperback, usually 6x8 or so, retailing for around $15. A mass-market is a "supermarket novel," a bit smaller, and retailing for around $7.99. Blockbuster novels tend to go hardback -> trade paperback -> mass market. Think of the progression of how you can purchase the Twilight series, for instance.

TPBs tend to have a slightly nicer cover than mass-markets, too...a satin stock, or a super-glossy, as opposed to flimsier mass-market paperbacks.

Royalties vary depending on volume and format.

Every writer should always read the whole of the contract, and understand it. Go over it with your agent or a lawyer...or even with the publishing house. Small publishers like Candlemark & Gleam are usually perfectly happy to explain any wording you don't understand. You do have to look out for yourself first - a publisher will always keep its own interests in mind first, no matter how helpful (I admit this freely!) - but you can usually get some explanations, if nothing else.

Thank you Wendy and Kate for answering my question!

thanks! helpful as ever!

Timothy Fish - Thank you!

I knew a bit about this before, but thanks so much for posting this. Learned a ton of the basics that I'm sure I'll be glad to know later!

Ouchie. I just got a headache reading all that, but it's good to know what's coming (I hope). Thanks, Rachelle!

This makes perfect sense. And fiction writers in particular should find it liberating. Instead of trying to anticipate a fickle market, we can write what we know, what we're passionate about, in the manner we do with most excellence. Even if it's rejected (whether by agent, editor, buyer), we will have been true to ourselves and our art.

Yes, this makes total sense. But I used to work for one of the most forward-thinking branding specialists in the world...

Don't invent the future: create it.

Perhaps not in publishing. But I think where book stores are concerned, some sort of market analysis should happen so that a supply and demande strategy can be put in place and maybe get rid of the outdated return system.

I work in publishing (mags and newspapers). We do a lot of research. In fact, this is the area I find most fascinating about publishing, so I read your post with a lot of interest.

Blog Maverick is wrong: EVERY company should ask their customers what they want. But market research is no crystal ball. Developers should not try and delegate the creative process of coming up with enhanced or new products to the customer. In effect, research BEFORE the product is at a dummy stage is absolutely useless. People wish for what they already know - only better and cheaper. That's a no-brainer, from a researcher's point of view. No professional company would undertake such research.

Once you have a nearly-finished product, though, you better listen closely to what people are saying. Sometimes what people want to tell you (customers really, truely want to help. Most people are thrilled to be asked their opinion) can make all the difference to the success or failure of a product. I remember focus groups once where people went on and on about WHERE they read their newspapers: on the sofa. It took hours before it came to us that the ink of a new Sunday product came off on their hands and they were worried about their expensive furniture. Rightly so! None of these people were AWARE of what they were telling us. The ink did not come up in their criticism at all because they basically liked the product.

It is sometimes hard to distinguish between perception and reality. EVERYONE wants to pass themselves off as more clever, more affluent and nicer than they actually are. So if you take the customer's word for it, you end up with very boring products no one will buy.

Coming from an industry that is not so far from book publishing, I would think in-depth interviews with six potential buyers would suffice to find inherent problems with a product. This research, of course, I would only conduct with the work of a reliable writer who intends to write a series and then pass the management summary on the the writer in small doses (magazine editors are prone to screaming when confronted with their reader's opinions - it would probably worse here where people cannot hide behind other people's blunders). One could end up with very valuable insights that far surpass the editor's judgement.

As with writing, though, the interpretation of the data is actually an art form not very many people are capable of. There are few very few good people out there who understand the process. David Zinkin in London, for example, is an absolute genius. Shame he does not do any work in the German market. Maybe I will take my own novel through the process and see how it goes? Should be interesting.

All the best from Germany, Barbara

Makes a ton of sense! Thanks for sharing!!

I love the Mark Cuban quote about inventing the future. I've been researching the bestseller lists (for fiction) of the past 70 to 80 years. At first I could see few trends, except that romance sales seem to peak during economic slowdowns, but eventually I realized that on nearly every list, year after year, there is one consistent bestseller. People are intrigued with and will buy books about a culture that is "new" to them. From Pearl S. Buck's THE GOOD EARTH to THE KITE RUNNER and even HARRY POTTER, we are a reading population of the curious, and I think that's great.

Good for Mark Cuban..."the best way to predict the future is to invent it..."

Sounds a lot like Steve Jobs...problem is, most people aren't as in-tune to the American zeitgeist as Steve Jobs is.

I think a better way is just to let someone else be on the cutting edge and just do what they do...only better.

Like our CEO says, the problem with being on the cutting edge is a lot of the time you bleed.

Computer books and various kinds of Bible study guides come to mind. While the market research might involve printing a book and asking how the customer likes various features, I can see where it would be useful for the publisher so they can include the best features in future books of that type and eliminate the wasted space for the others.

In fiction it may seem like the product is one book, but in many cases this is far from the truth. My mother has been buying every book from Harlequin’s Steeple Hill Love Inspired Suspense line, but she won’t buy books from the Love Inspired line. In that case, the product isn’t the individual novel by an individual author but the line of books by several different authors.

You mention a matter of integrity and that it goes against the grain of writers and publishers to change the product to suit the whims of the consumer. I’m not sure if I would call that integrity or arrogance. If I were teaching a class, my presentation would be completely different if I were presenting it to a group of Harvard graduates than what it would be if I were presenting it to a group of kindergarteners. If I were teaching something from the Bible, my presentation to a group of Sunday school teachers would be different than my presentation to a group of atheists. As a writer, it is in my best interest to know who my audience is and if necessary, change my writing accordingly. That doesn’t mean I should change my convictions based on my audience, but there are things that should be changed if we hope to communicate well.

Sue, My coffee hasn't kicked in. I thought you wrote "I've been researching the bestseller lists FOR the past 70 or 80 years...." And I thought, WOW! There's a woman who really wants to break out! :)

BTW, can you point us toward a link where you can view archived bestseller lists? Thank you.

As a former market researcher, I offer this: packaging, pricing, and promotion (that is, factors that might influence purchase) might be good to research, most probably in a general sense.
Customers usually don't know what they want. Focus groups are great, because often it's the participants' nonverbal reactions that tell the story. But, as a qualitative method, you might not want to bet the budget on the results.
I think common sense and a good bit of intuition and hunch go a long way.

nice. i agree this makes sense. when i think about the books that have really made it big there was a confluence of events that surrounded their rise. copycats quickly followed with ever diminishing returns. i think yu just might drive yourself crazy trying to write the next big thing you just might miss it.

Interesting post Rachelle. Thanks.

I would think that market research in pub would be cost prohibitive. Also, how many Meyer's, Brown's, Grisham's and even Austen's would never be available to the public if research had worked against them. Besides, there are many great artists who never made a dime during their lifetimes, but we recognize, celebrate and admire their genious. No amount of market research would have helped any of them & I don't think any amt. of research can predict the next hot item. Punt, pray and hope for the best. There is a place for everyone and for every writer an audience. No MR could ever define that successfully enough, so we just have to go for it. Great thought provoker for a Tuesday morning, though. Thanks!

I agree. I mean, if I was at the group to approve Twilight, I´d deny it and then, bye bye crazy phenomenum.

The best way to predict the future is to invent it."
is one of the best lines I´ve ever heard =)

I think your argument is sound as far as it goes, but I don't think it addresses all things that market research could do for publishers.

It is a fact that men read less fiction than woman. Unless we believe that it is impossible to get men to read more fiction, we must believe that there are things that can be done to get men to read more. How are we to find out what those things are? Market research. We've discussed this on the Boylit Blog.

Men as a demographic are a rather large group to just ignore and it would be in the industry's interest to do the research to determine what male non-readers would like to read and how best to reach them.

It's true that people don't necessarily know what they like and are even less likely to be able to articulate what it is they like. However, there are scientific methods that could be used to determine what appeals to a given group, as opposed to just soliciting opinions. For instance, if you give a focus group the first chapters of a few books and give them the option of either requesting or declining more chapters of the books, you may learn what it is that group likes. I am sure that market research professionals could come up with very productive studies to do.

I do think you have to target the research to particular demographics in order to determine what the demographic enjoys as opposed to the general population. I would love to see such research done in schools in order to gain some insight into what boys, particularly reluctant readers, want to read and how to reach them.

One of the things that we have discussed is the use of book trailers on Youtube to reach boys. The demographic that represents young boys is overrepresented in its usage of Youtube, but publishers don't seem to take advantage of that. I think there are lots of things that could be learned from market research other than whether or not a particular book is going to be popular.

Having worked in marketing (among other things) and having been involved in business my whole life, I have to disagree with the idea that 'people don't know what they want'. That's very general to say the least.

Here's what people REALLY want. They want a quality product, they want it to entertain them and they don't want to feel like they've been ripped off.

I don;t care if you sell books, DVDs or bagels. People want the above - period.

As far as young men reading, let's take a look at what we are offering them (promotions wise) IF they have 2 minutes to decide (and that's about 1:55 more than the average young man spends making entertainment decisions!) They see Twilight, Harry Potter and Anita Blake plastered all over the place. All of those books have cross-over appeal, but do 18-24 year old guys want Vampire love, kids on broom sticks or Urban fantasy/paranormal romance smut? Probably not.

The industry really doesn't seem to be offering them much (on the surface anyway). Yes there are options for young men (or whatever other age/gender/race/etc group you want to target) but when publishers blow their promotional efforts on the next Twilight book and Sarah Palin's new memoir, they are not getting the word out about something that might interest the underrepresented 49% of the population (book reading wise anyway - we are doing fine in pro-sports representation and biker gang membership thankyouverymuch!)

Really, how hard would it be to go after those Youtube folks with a viral marketing campaign for the next epic fantasy or military thriller or sci-fi adventure? Probably a lot less money than what they could get in return if they stopped the 'big book' model that continues to squeeze out everyone else...

I found your remarks about “integrity issues” interesting. As an economist I have to consider what it means to not want to conform or adapt to consumer preferences.

I think, in the first place, you are right. There is a tremendous feeling among artists that they are creating something which has to be expressed regardless of whether or not other people “get it.” Some writers, I imagine, would consider it a badge of honor if their work was underappreciated as it would reinforce their feeling of having an uncommon understanding of things.

But to the point of whether or not publishers and writers adapt their “product” to meet consumers’ expressed preferences: they most certainly do. That’s how supply and demand works. If consumers want something they’ll buy more of it. If writers and publishers want to sell products they need to meet those needs.

A publisher may not go to an author and say, change your book to include a subplot of unrequited love, but they have a lot of novels to choose from. If publishers are consistently selecting stories with a similar subplot, authors will pick up on this and write to it.

It’s a more subtle influence than outright telling them what to write, but every writer knows there are some things that will sell and some things that won’t. if you want to get published you don’t try to convince the world your idea of what they should read is better, you shape your ideas to fit the product they enjoy.

I have enjoyed reading your blog. Thanks for sharing your wisdom with all of us.

Katy, I'm still laughing. I'm not that dedicated (or that old!). For archived bestseller lists check out the Hawes Publications Website at http://www.hawes.com/pastlist.htm

Also, Wikipedia has an article about New York Times Bestseller Lists. At the bottom of the article there is a list of various links. They're interesting to peruse!

Publishers do do market research, only theirs is a trailing model. They look at an author's submission, look at the past sales figures for that author, if already published, look at the sales figures for books similar to the author's if not published, and make a preliminary judgment on that basis.

Then they look at the book itself, which has already been pre-screened by the author's agent, who has already gone through the same exercise, vetting the work before approaching the publisher.

It's kind of hard to see how they can lose with this model, unless the public stops buying books, period.

Good morning, Rachele;

You wrote on a subject of continuing debate in many companies. Doing research to quantify the effectiveness of market research is similar to chasing will-o-whisps in the swamp; market research might be valuable but the value can't be captured.

The facts that human nature never changes but tastes do, in my opinion, explains why some market research gives usable results and some does not. And speaking from experience, even when a company has good market research, it may not know how to use it.

Better, I think, for a writer to find an audience who will respond to their voice, find an agent and publisher who can refine the work, and then meet that audience's desire - whether it be for a fad like Twilight or a need like dealing with the death of a loved one.

Be blessed,

Lynnda

Market research can make sense in certain situations. I work for a small niche publisher of religious nonfiction, and we've polled our customers to find out what general types of books they felt most need for, as well as how well they felt we were currently meeting their needs. We spent nothing (beyond a few hours to set up the survey and to evaluate the results) and got some useful results. But certainly with regard to fiction, market research is pretty useless.

When I first read the title of the blog post, I thought "Wait a second....you mean they DON'T?"

But after reading the reasons you give, it totally makes sense.

Thanks, Rochelle.

You make good points, but I still think there are areas where publishers could benefit from market research. Every industry has blind spots, and it sometimes takes someone else to reveal them. Here's an interesting article where the author argues that there is a market for male-oriented books, it's just that the female heavy publishing industry has not been producing books for them. http://www.huffingtonpost.com/jason-pinter/why-men-dont-read-how-pub_b_549491.html

And as to suiting the whims of the consumer, doesn't the publishing industry already kind of do that? There's a reason why publishers don't buy short story collections and poetry very often. I don't really see it as an integrity issue. It's just what sells and what doesn't.

I should think that fiction market research would be particularly difficult to pin down.

Non-fiction market research? I have a friend who is shopping a women's devotional series, and the publishers who have shown an interest all want her to hold focus groups and find out the 'felt needs' of the women she's trying to reach, then tweak the proposal based upon their feedback. In this limited way, she's responsible for her own market research.

I think publishers miss a chance to use market research to publish "outside the box." Because they're probably working from existing sales data, they make choices about what to publish two years from now based on what is selling today. In romances, that means paranormals are big now, so paranormals may be big in two years.

But if someone with Stephenie Meyer's ability comes along and sells a great book about something totally different, that will breed a lot more of that new thing. The problem is that publishers aren't looking for The Next New Thing, they're still looking for The Old Thing in a new wrapper.

So here are two very specific ways in which publishers can use market research to find The New Thing more easily. First, if a manuscript is submitted to them through an agent or "over the transom," but it's a New Thing, they don't have to publish it to see if people like it. They could test it first. (There has to be some contract whereby an author would be recompensed for, say, losing the opportunity to sell the book elsewhere while the market research is being conducted.)

Second, publishers could ask long-time readers what they most like. This could bridge the gap caused by a stochastic model where future sales are shaped by past sales. Each book sold is a book sold, but did people actually like it and would they have preferred something different?

Take, say, educated heroines. Maybe readers would like to read more novels with well-educated heroines. But that's not what's being written now, so it's not what's being sold, so it's not what publishers see as doing well. A modest amount of market research could tell publishers that readers enjoy their books but "wish the heroines were better-educated," say. (It's a hypothetical example.)

The publisher would then alert its editors that this is something its readers have said they'd like more of. The next author of a new book with a more educated heroine might find his/her manuscript getting a green light where it otherwise might not.

We all know that even well-written books get rejected sometimes because publishers *think* they know what sells. We also know that publishers can be surprised by how well The Next New Thing does; market research could help them have a feel for what New Things readers are receptive to.

Market research is a way to let readers tell publishers more about reader-driven preferences than actual book sales reveal.

Makes perfect sense. Predicting the future by re-inventing it works for the delivery system. Not so much for the content.

The i-pod reinvented how music is listened to, but did not reinvent music.

E-readers do the same for publishing. The writing is still hard work and there is not much that can change this.

As an author the easy way to accomplish a market survey would be to look at the best-seller list. Or look for other books in the same field and see if they are selling.

As a marketing professional I do believe that research provides important baseline statistics for measuring and predicting trends.

That being said, there is a real limit to how useful this historical evidence is in a world that is changing at an ever increasing pace.

As writers we can keep a finger in the wind to sample prevailing winds, but mostly we need our eyes "on the ball" of creating compelling stories with riveting characters.

A great book will never be out of style.

We can’t ask readers what type of book they would like to read and expect them to give us the answer we want. They will likely tell us about books they have enjoyed reading in the past, but since they have already read those books it would do us little good to write another. A better question would be, “What problem do you currently face that you wish you knew how to solve?”

Suppose the answer comes back, “I wish I knew how to get my grandchildren actively involved in church.” We can then look around to see if there is a book that addresses that issue. If we don’t see anything, there is a gap that needs someone to fill it. As authors, we may not be qualified to write that book, but a publisher can seek out an author to write that book, publish it and make it available to the audience that is looking for it.

The novels we would write based on that answer may not be as obvious, but maybe we do just write a novel about a woman who sets out to get her grandchildren in church. We go around to various groups to speak on the subject and using the concept that the non-fiction themes of a fiction book sell the story, we may still be able to sell books to that audience based on need.

"Mark says, 'The best way to predict the future is to invent it.'"

Right or wrong, I think to a degree publishers have attempted to do this. They've shortened the novels and only allowed "sagas" in certain genres. CBA publishers decided at some point that the fantasy genre didn't sell when in fact there are myriad readers and writers of fantasy who are Christians. I suspect the publishers had difficulty marketing it until recently.

Men's fiction has been poorly marketed. I know lots of men (Christians) who read fiction but have no idea what's available from CBA.

So the CBA publishers who cater to their main market of women readers have failed to address the rest of the market. And with a huge percentage of published books not earning out advances, something is not quite right in their market choices or their marketing schemes.

This makes perfect sense.
Also, publishing IS market research!
If people don't buy the book in a certain area, that demographic didn't find it interesting.
If people don't buy the book during Christmas season, a murderous adultress doesn't sell at that time of year.

As was said, writers and publishers don't cater to the public, but the public will respond. One way or the other.

I have to agree with Anne Lang Bundy. It is a wonderful liberating feeling to forge our own trail as authors, rather than feel compelled to follow the latest, greatest trend.

There are other industries with such broad products - music, motor spares, art. Many others mass customise, resulting in unique customer-products. They research product categories and demographic groups. Post research informs on what happened, but never says anything about what didn't happen i.e. why demographics with potential are not buying and why, so its self defeating to opt out.

There are other industries with such broad products - music, motor spares, art. Many others mass customise, resulting in unique customer-products. They research product categories and demographic groups. Post research informs on what happened, but never says anything about what didn't happen i.e. why demographics with potential are not buying and why, so its self defeating to opt out.

Thanks for the post! This is a topic I've thought of much, as it's where my day job and writing intersect.

I understand the Mark Cuban post on "never listening" to your customers, best summed up by Henry Ford who said that if he had asked people what they wanted they would have said: faster horses. But Cuban oversimplifies. In focus groups, a/b testing, and other types of similar research, you don't ask customers what they want. You learn from listening and watching them. The Swiffer mop is a great example. The people who developed it watched people clean their floors, and were surprised at how much time people spent cleaning what they clean the floor with versus the floor itself. No one said: It takes me too long to clean the mop. This came through observation.

I also don't understand the argument that publishers don't have the time or money to conduct research, since they're so busy publishing so many books. My understanding is that most books lose money. Why spend so much money and time to produce so many products that don't work? Why not stop publishing the books that lose money and only publish those that make money? How can you move toward better telling the two apart? One way is market research.

I also think you've overstated the costs. Moving online has streamlined both the time and effort required to really connect with customers. (This blog is also a form of market research.) For a few thousand dollars, publishers could set up focus groups with 100 readers--the exact demographic they're targeting--and ask them to comment on and rate samples from 50 books under consideration. That sort of insight would be fascinating, and go a long way to understanding why readers are drawn to some books and not to others.

My hunch is the reason this hasn't happened is that editors would see it as a threat to their editorial role. I've seen this in other businesses, where this type of research is initially rejected by those in decision-making roles. It takes time to bring them on board, once they understand that ultimately the final decision is still their's to make. The customer input is just there to help with the process.

Any publisher who stooped to actually ASK their readers what should be published should just go ahead and shut their doors. Seriously, most good writers get a much better shot (even with the long odds) of getting published now than if market research took over or heavily influenced publishing. It would be sort of like the computer that took over the Enterprise and ended up identifying friendly vessels as enemy ships in an "exercise"--and torpedoed several ships before the crew could get to the manual override and shut it down. Agents and editors are the "human" element that identifies the artistic and business value of books. No system is perfect, but we trust their judgement over scientific models and methods.

"Barbara Krasner said...
As a former market researcher, I offer this: packaging, pricing, and promotion (that is, factors that might influence purchase) might be good to research, most probably in a general sense."

I agree with Barbara here. Plus, correct me if I'm wrong (if there's still anyone at the party), but I have participated in market research for a CBA publisher--I was asked via an online survey which book cover I liked best. At least, this to me is market research: Would you buy this book based on this cover? How about this cover?

Use market research to ask readers what kinds of books they are looking for and not finding. Do followups to see how much potential audience these "missing" categories represent. Those categories which are large enough to be salable, marginally sabable, or which could become salable with some effort should be encouraged by publishers sending out the word they are looking for this kind of writing.

-Steve

Rachelle, I'm so surprised that you speak about "integrity issues" with publishing: "Market research implies the author/publisher would change the product to suit the whims of the consumer, something that goes against the grain of writers and publishers."

But this happens all the time!!

As a publicist and marketing pro I have worked with dozens of authors and have seen so many of them collude with their agents and/or
editors to re-write or develop more marketable, potentially "crowd-pleasing" books. It's always struck me that their big mistake has been to wonder not what readers will potentially like, but what current trends are. So we wind up with many books that look alike but just don't sell, and plenty of money invested in these with relatively little money invested in new ideas and approaches that could become the next trend.

And while we're on spending: how on earth do publishers justify giving new authors fairly large advances with no indication of how their books will sell (even low 5-figures seems pretty big to me!) or giving second and even third advances to returning authors whose books haven't necessarily sold enough copies to break even? I'd say those dollars would be much better spent on market research!

Yet we continue to blame low profitability problems on things like e-books. And just as you once said that being an agent is, after all, a job.... Publishers are, first and foremost, businesses.

The idea of not writing is far more depressing than the state of the industry. I love writing and couldn't imagine doing anything else. I'd rather eat rice and write than swim in caviar on CEO's pay.

It's cliche, of course, but success happens when failure's just not an option.

I was told I'd never walk, let alone fly a plane, again after a vertebral fracture injured my spinal cord in 1994. I was back in the cockpit a year later.

Doctors told me what they did because they didn't want to give me "false hope." I don't believe there is a such thing. Work like it all depends on you and pray like it all depends on God.

Remember your Shakespeare: "There are more things in heaven and earth, Horatio, than are dreamt of in your philosophy."

If you can't die unpublished, you won't. But keep taking your vitamins...

Honestly: Through massive self delusion.

It works, trust me.

For me, I simply want to write. Need to write these stories. Sure, the goal is to be published some day but not making that goal won't harm me in any way. I write these novels because they want me to write them. In some ways, I ignore the gloom and doom of the industry because it doesn't pertain to me at this point. That and I believe that success can come to those that are persistent. It may not be easy but that's a good thing and something that I believe I can overcome.

Creative approaches to marketing oneself and one's products is definitely a necessity. Examine the trends that are out there and see what can work best for you and whenever you can try to set your own trends. When something's not working analyze why and fix it.

Arlee Bird
Blogging From A to Z April Challenge

"Bottom line? Yeah, it's hard. So what? If it were easy, anyone could do it." - Perfect!

I'm not striving to just be anyone.

E.D. Lindquist, I feel the same exact way.

I have to remind myself that the Lord is strongest when I'm weak. Right now I'm soluble as water. According to His word, I'm in the very best place for Him to help me.

Believe that with every negative, there is a positive. It will not rain forever, or for forty days and forty nights.

Everyone knows everything in publishing moves really slowly. By the time my WIP (or my next WIP, or the next one) is ready for submission, it could be the best time in publishing for authors. You just never know.

Kierah Jane
http://kierahjane.blogspot.com

Well all those doom and gloom statements don't sound anything different to me - as I've been hearing all that kind of "you'll never publish your genre" since I started out. I just don't take any notice, that seems to work.

:)

Sometimes, it feels like I'm swimming against the current. But it's made me stronger and better. I just can't give up on something I believe in so strongly. My heart won't let me. Best of luck to everyone as they pursue their dreams, whatever they might be. Blessings....

The only basis for persistance at any task (motherhood included) is because you think it's worth doing. Certainly not because you expect financial rewards -- if you didn't think it was worth doing the reward will never be adequate compensation

Proverbs 31:25--"...She can laugh at the days to come."

I appreciate God's sense of humor. For twenty years I didn't write at all. The writing finally returned at the beginning of a VERY difficult period in publishing. It figures, right?

But I know He has a plan for my life, and there's a reason for the timing. Even if I never get published, I trust Him. And trusting, I can laugh at myself and my predicament. :-)

I persist with something you mentioned. If this was easy, anyone could do it. And the higher I want to go with a career, the stiffer the competition and the harder I have to work.

I think of all the people in the Bible who were seemingly no-bodies with zero abilities but God used them to do awesome things! I think that's when I see God's hand the most, when everything seems impossible, God gets that sneaky little grin of his and says, "Ha, just you wait and see, Krista Jean!" My future lies in his hands, and there is NO place I'd rather it be!

I loved what Buffy wrote about swimming against the current making you stronger. To persist, I just keep exercising the muscles, hoping that my writing gets stronger and tighter as I persist. I'm proud to be 3 of those contracts you announced last week. :-) And in such hard (publishing) times yet!

If I want it badly enough, I'll keep going until I achieve it. Or as Dori says in Finding Nemo, "Just keep swimming." :)

I’m right there with Kabbu. When I sit down to write, I imagine my audience is much larger than it is. I look at statements like those you listed and I tell myself that I will be one of the exceptions. I learned to listen to my mother a long time ago and my mother says that I write better than most people. Of course, I save all of my fan mail, especially the stuff from strangers, so that when reality starts to rear its ugly head, I can read through it and pat myself on the back. If all else fails, I go visit my characters and let them tell me what a great writer I am.

I'm writing another book, headed to a writer's conference in May and reading and studying all the time!

I'm coming to a place of peace that my audience is small....if I encourage one mom....help a parent rethink their kid's challenges....

Or even if I write for an audience of One.

It's okay. My gifting and how and when or even IF it's showcased to a larger audience....I'm okay with that. (Most days, anyway. ;) )

If I didn't love books and writing so much, I don't know if I'd keep going. But, the thought of stopping just isn't an option. I waited too long to realize my dreams to give up on them. Many years of "life in the way" before I was finally able to write again-seriously for publication I mean - in my late forties has made me more determined; maybe it's a "Time's a-wastin'" attitude.

I think if we recognize that maybe how we THOUGHT things would happen may not happen just in that particular way, and keep our options more maleable, then we're better off. I can't tell you the times I've heard, "Once I finish my book, I'm going to get it published and quit my job!" . . . Big chances are, that isn't going to happen, but other wonderful things can happen!

After nearly twenty years? It has to be about the writing, and trusting God has a plan for it, and not getting too worked up when His plan doesn't match mine. I started writing with some idea of being published in 1991. I was offered representation by an agent... last month.

The odds are long, but they're a lot longer if I quit.

I just assume it's always been hard and if it's harder now, then it's my fault for having waited so long to remember that writing is my LIFE. Yeah, sure that other job was fun, but I could've been writing for the last ten years. I chose this time to 'break-out' and I've gotta lay in the bed I waited to be made for me! LOL!

We're at a crossroad. We don't know which path the written word will take. Most of the major periodicals are close to bankruptcy and the advent of electronic readers have everyone stunned. Will we finally see the printed page become a thing of the past?

One thing is certain, everything is going to change. But the work must go on.

"Thirty is the new fifty..."

ahahahaha

Writing is how I entertain myself. I don't have cable, I don't go out a lot on weekends, and I have a lot of time to myself and my thoughts, so I write. I try to get published. I'm querying now. But each rejection letter I get, I just go 'okay,' and put the agent's name on a spreadsheet I made. I'm in my thirties, but I still think I'm young enough and have decades ahead of me to plod along and someday get published. I know of people who never got published until they were over sixty, so there's hope yet!

When I'm down and out (especially since fifty must be the new 100)I quite.....lol.
I quite whining and complaining and pick up my laptop to get back to work. "Thirty the new fifty..." Babies! Get to work. There are readers out there who need us!

See even old age forgets how to spell-- That's exactly why I don't quit. I would lose my mind

I think those things are daunting but not discouraging. This is why I love to hear success stories and to read how authors started out. At the risk of sounding religious, I really do believe God has a good plan for my life and that if I follow Him things will be how they need to be. So that makes things easier too. 'Course, I'm really hoping God's plan for me includes a career writing fiction! *grin*

It all sounds discouraging, but you'll never win if you don't try. As in the old saying golfers often use, "One hundred percent of putts that are short don't go in."

"Constant toil is the law of art, as it is of life" Balzac

Rachelle, I think it's important we ALL stay flexible. I've come to some big realizations in light of these changes in the publishing world and am adjusting to them in my own particular way. It's meant letting go of a few dreams, and embracing new ones. I am okay with that, at this moment. As much as we all desire publication, and traditional as our first choice, I also think that we can get so focused on that...that we forget the joy of the writing journey. Letting go, doing what we can, and letting God take care of the final results is how I'm trying to approach this whole thing, and I am more at peace about it than ever, despite all the unknowns.

I agree that we just have to keep writing and learning. With each new WIP, the writing gets better and that's what we strive for. Keep querying, file those rejection letters away and move on. It only takes one agent to love your book.

I just tell myself that God gave me a gift. I don't know if He necessarily wants me to use it for publishing books or not. He could use my writing in some other way. But I DESIRE to be published some day, and I know this is a desire He's given me. And I trust God, so it'll work out in His timing. That's what I have to tell myself.

Love your picture - that's awesome. :)

Hard times...perseverance.....well, I start with rock solid determination, then I feel sorry for myself, then I decide to quit, then I decide not to quit, and we're back to determination. It's a circular process, and I do this for most things in my life. For example, I've noticed that whenever I have a paper due for school, I decide it's time to quit school. This is just too hard, I didn't sign up for this, it sucks, I don't want to do it, I'm going back to bed, besides I can't write etc. etc.

Then I write the paper.

In terms of publishing, I think you're right, Rachelle, that the economy is putting a negative overlay on this, but in the longer picture, I feel optimistic. I think this is a very exciting time to be an author. The opportunities have never been more accessible - things could go in an amazing direction. I hope so anyway.

Thanks for the topic and the encouragement, Rachelle.

Oh, and congratulations on your contracts!!! That's wonderfulYour clients are very lucky to have such a skilled advocate on their side. :)

I ignore the doom and gloomers. Anything worth doing is going to be hard, publishing is no different. If someone is telling me I just can't get my stories published, I ignore them, and try to spend less time with them. Life's too short to listen to such negativity, no matter what the topic.

I believe I could suffer through every one of these and still keep a smile on my face.

But thirty is the new fifty?


*waaaaaaaaaaahhhh*

I sure do hope the publishing industry improves. I really want to be published some day! But I'd write every day whether or not that happened. I couldn't imagine not writing!

People always like to say things were easier "back in the day." Perhaps that's true according to statistics, but it still wasn't EASY. Just google your favorite authors and read about their struggle to publication. So I try to ignore all those glass-is-half-empty people!

Not for the faint of heart, but it never really was.

I get up every morning and I get to write. I think that too 'I get to write!' I started writing as a kid and so many things barged in and crowded my time-school, sleep ; - )...I can remember getting up while it was still dark out to write.

I can remember sitting up until the wee hours to write.

The destination (publication) will happen when it's supposed to happen but meanwhile, I get to write!

That may be a little Pollyanna-ish but it's the way I feel. I wanted to be a writer for as long as I can remember. I don't recall ever thinking 'I want to be a published author' but that I want to write.

I get to write! I'm already living my dream.

I'm twisted, I guess. I get a creative rush when the odds are stacked against me. Maybe it's because I'm also a gym rat; I don't mind sweating.

Oddly because the publishing news is just that itty bit less depressing than the news about my college education. Eventually both can happen if I want it bad enough I tell myself. At this point though I want the book published more then my degree which is sad.

From the first moment I used the iPad, my decision to self publish suddenly became very simple.

Perhaps I'm too stubborn to give up? : )

I think I persist because I never thought it'd be easy. I believed other authors, editors, agents and publishers when they said it's difficult to get published but it can be done.

And I look around book stores and see all the books and magazines on the shelf and know that it can be done if you keep trying.

At first, I was down on e-books--but then I saw them as a way to sell a book TWICE, or even THREE times--e.g. hardback, paperback, e-books--giving authors a chance to make even more profit and earn their advances.

It seems agents, editors and publishers could make faster decisions with a tighter budget so why the delay? Books will always be in demand, no matter the format.

"It's harder than ever to get a book deal."

But it is easier, and cheaper, than ever to connect with readers throughout the globe.

"Advances are lower than they've been in years."

But the money is in the crossover.

"Thirty is the new fifty."

But fifty is the new thirty.

"Publishers are taking so long to make decisions these days."

And when they do, they are more likely to be good decisions with committed resources.

"When you finally get a book deal, your advance could be spread out over two years or more."

So you have something to look forward to.

"The big houses are aggressively seeking household names and celebrity authors."

And with 200 primary television channels, the Internet, and social networking, what constitutes a household name is more universally attainable than when James Patterson had to buy high end spots on network television just to get his name out there.

"There seem to be fewer slots for debut authors."

Fewer than what? Plato, I believe, said "Non-debut authors are mortal." Debut is the headwaters of any revenue stream - publishers know that choking off debut only results in a dry stream...

I'm focusing on writing as my hobby. I think about it like playing an instrument. I don't stop playing, practicing, and enjoying the piano just because I'm not Lang Lang. And truthfully, it's liberating. When I'm always thinking about--what will readers think of this, is this literary enough, a publisher would hate this, is there a market for this, is there another obscure novel with the very same story, etc--I psych myself out. When I focus on just writing cause it's fun, I write better and...it's more fun.

I persist because publication is the thing I desire most from life, and writing is a gift I really feel God gave to me. I'm awful at a lot of things, but I'm not an awful writer. :) I can't imagine giving up. I can't imagine being satisfied with a non-writing life.

I *have* prayed, though, that if publication *isn't* God's will, He'll give me peace with that. I certainly wouldn't have peace with it on my own. But by no means does that signify I care less about publication, or am anywhere near giving up.

Well, I guess the only thing worse than being a writer is working in publishing. My husband, who works in publishing, came home the other and said (I think the day the ipad came out), "It's all over now." I work in books and I'm trying to think of an alternate career--maybe medical records? I'm only half-kidding. As for writing, I'm with Mira above. I write, I quit, I write again. Can't really stop.

If it were easy, anyone could do it.

You say that like it's a bad thing!

I am reminded of the quote by Pablo Picasso, "Inspiration exists, but it has to find us working.”

If it were easy, anyone could do it.

So, if we can show that anyone can do it, does that mean that it's easy?

Rejection is far more discouraging than how the industry pays.

I'd rather be a published author with a low advance than an unpublished author with no advance.

Maribeth:)

Rejection is far more discouraging than how the industry pays.

I'd rather be a published author with a low advance than an unpublished author with no advance.

Maribeth:)

I tend to live in denial! Works every time!

And I think most of us do this because it fills a void, in the hopes that one day someone will want to read what we've created.

The doom and gloom can't touch that. :-)

Through prayer, I get an understanding over and over again that it is in His timing. I keep focused on my ministry and WHY I wrote my story and it all comes into perspective.

I know the odds, have wrestled with the idea that I may have to wait a long time, and it relaxes me into pushing on.

a

Thirty is the new fifty? Yikes!

I persist with prayer and remembering Who I serve. If God is for me, who can be against me? And if I don't keep working to receive the gift I asked for, He can't give it to me. ;)

Why are writers so surprised that getting published is hard? I can remember back in 70s-80s, people making many of the same complaints I read now.

In many cases, they weren't willing to put in the effort to meet the markets half-way. I think the best advice would be to persevere and learn all you can.

I've always said that a real writer is someone who would write regardless of the size of the audience. I've been writing for over 20 years, three books and a national column and I've never heard anyone say, 'this is going to be easy'. Plus, there have been a lot of other challenges in life that were tougher and just as worthwhile.
I write because I love it and I turn over the outcomes to God. That's the deal regardless of what I choose to do with my time so I might as well enjoy the ride.

I'm extremely fortunate to work with the people I write about and for - teenagers. I have been an English Teacher working in Greece for 20 years and for that long have been writing various projects for MY ANGELS. Whether I get published or not is not really an issue - I'll still continue writing. I've only seriously thought about querying for two months so I believe I have time ahead to work and learn as much as I can!
The writing will never stop though!

I still keep writing, polishing, submitting. Before, the odds of being published seemed to be a million to one. Now they're two million to one. In practical terms, not a lot of difference. I'm not expecting to get rich quick, so I'll just keep doing what I do, keep praying over it, and be thankful to enjoy telling stories.

I love a challenge. When I decided to write my story three years ago, it was with the understanding that 10 people may read it or a million. What is most important, to me, is having the passion to get it on paper. And I have plenty of passion!

I agree with one of the first posters-delusion. If I can convince myself I'll make it- I can keep going until I've gotten so far, that it doesn't make any sense to quit.

That- and it's fun. Even when it's not fun, it's still a little bit fun. If it weren't enjoyable- I probably wouldn't be doing it.

It is hard and rare to be successful, but I believe we all need to listen and then do. Faith is a powerful thing, if we follow where it leads. I know it will happen, when, where and how? Only God knows.

Isn't it funny how perspective changes everything. It's not really about what we think, it's about how we choose to think and what we choose to do about it.

With that in mind, let's reword the whiney (and admittedly somewhat legitimate) excuses.

Thought: "It's harder than ever to get a book deal."
Choice: "Cyberspace makes it easier than ever to find out who is open to unsolicited manuscripts"


Thought: "Advances are lower than they've been in years."
Choice: "My advance may be lower than usual, but it's a foot in the door and an opportunity to market my book for more pay in royalties."

Thought: "Thirty is the new fifty."
Choice: "Fifty is the new thrity."


Thought: "Publishers are taking so long to make decisions these days."
Choice: "While I'm waiting for publishers to make their decision, I'll have time to begin working on my next project. That way I'll be ready to present my next book the minute they say yes to the one they're looking at now."

Thought: "When you finally get a book deal, your advance could be spread out over two years or more."
Choice: "If I really want to write fulltime, I need to resolve myself to the fact that money may trickle in for a while before buckets of money begin dropping from the sky."

Thought: "The big houses are aggressively seeking household names and celebrity authors."
Choice: "I'll never despise the days of small beginnings. I am not done becoming who I was created to be."

Thought: "There seem to be fewer slots for debut authors."
Choice: "'Dig in girl, you've got some work to do!' There may be fewer slots, but I'm going to do everything I can to make sure my name is on one of them."

We may never be a big time author who is sought out by the big publishing houses. But if we choose to allow our thoughts to become excuses, we'll never know what we could have done. Perpective changes everything.

Isn't it funny how perspective changes everything. It's not really about what we think, it's about how we choose to think and what we choose to do about it.

With that in mind, let's reword the whiney (and admittedly somewhat legitimate) excuses.

Thought: "It's harder than ever to get a book deal."
Choice: "Cyberspace makes it easier than ever to find out who is open to unsolicited manuscripts"


Thought: "Advances are lower than they've been in years."
Choice: "My advance may be lower than usual, but it's a foot in the door and an opportunity to market my book for more pay in royalties."

Thought: "Thirty is the new fifty."
Choice: "Fifty is the new thrity."


Thought: "Publishers are taking so long to make decisions these days."
Choice: "While I'm waiting for publishers to make their decision, I'll have time to begin working on my next project. That way I'll be ready to present my next book the minute they say yes to the one they're looking at now."

Thought: "When you finally get a book deal, your advance could be spread out over two years or more."
Choice: "If I really want to write fulltime, I need to resolve myself to the fact that money may trickle in for a while before buckets of money begin dropping from the sky."

Thought: "The big houses are aggressively seeking household names and celebrity authors."
Choice: "I'll never despise the days of small beginnings. I am not done becoming who I was created to be."

Thought: "There seem to be fewer slots for debut authors."
Choice: "'Dig in girl, you've got some work to do!' There may be fewer slots, but I'm going to do everything I can to make sure my name is on one of them."

We may never be a big time author who is sought out by the big publishing houses. But if we choose to allow our thoughts to become excuses, we'll never know what we could have done. Perpective changes everything.

Isn't it funny how perspective changes everything. It's not really about what we think, it's about how we choose to think and what we choose to do about it.

With that in mind, let's reword the whiney (and admittedly somewhat legitimate) excuses.

Thought: "It's harder than ever to get a book deal."
Choice: "Cyberspace makes it easier than ever to find out who is open to unsolicited manuscripts"


Thought: "Advances are lower than they've been in years."
Choice: "My advance may be lower than usual, but it's a foot in the door and an opportunity to market my book for more pay in royalties."

Thought: "Thirty is the new fifty."
Choice: "Fifty is the new thrity."


Thought: "Publishers are taking so long to make decisions these days."
Choice: "While I'm waiting for publishers to make their decision, I'll have time to begin working on my next project. That way I'll be ready to present my next book the minute they say yes to the one they're looking at now."

Thought: "When you finally get a book deal, your advance could be spread out over two years or more."
Choice: "If I really want to write fulltime, I need to resolve myself to the fact that money may trickle in for a while before buckets of money begin dropping from the sky."

Thought: "The big houses are aggressively seeking household names and celebrity authors."
Choice: "I'll never despise the days of small beginnings. I am not done becoming who I was created to be."

Thought: "There seem to be fewer slots for debut authors."
Choice: "'Dig in girl, you've got some work to do!' There may be fewer slots, but I'm going to do everything I can to make sure my name is on one of them."

We may never be a big time author who is sought out by the big publishing houses. But if we choose to allow our thoughts to become excuses, we'll never know what we could have done. Perpective changes everything.

The cream will always rise to the top, one would hope, survival of the fittest and all.

One would think that only the best of the best would be available to the consumer,especially if it is such a difficult road. Sadly, this isn't the case.

Why not?

Ha. Just keep querying. And when that spout has run dry just put it on the shelf for a bit and work on something new. When that new work is completed but not edited to its fullest extent then you take that old work off the shelf and blow off the dust. With this, you requery old agencies you tried before (it could be what the market is looking for now) and new agents while you edit the new book you just wrote.

...At least, this is my strategy. That way I am driven and will not give up. I will always have something going for me in the future.

Enjoying the comments.

God has given me a message and in His time, it will be published. :)

Very comforting... and relaxing...

Congrats to you and your clients on all the contracts!!

Maybe I'm just feeling a bit more contrary than usual today.

You said:

Bottom line? Yeah, it's hard. So what? If it were easy, anyone could do it.

I'd like to see that turned completely on its head. It should be easy. Everybody should do it. The virtues of suffering are way overrated.

Just a thought,
-Steve

When the harsh realities of publishing become my personal realities, i.e. I get a rejection, I allow myself 24 to 48 hours to sulk. I vent. I watch a movie or two. I do a little shopping therapy.
Then I pick myself up, dust my battered ego off and start over again because I am, after all, a writer.
I surround myself with encouraging writing comrades who pray for me, pull out my best writing, and remind me why I am doing this.
And I look for the opportunity to encourage other writers who aren't as far along the writing road as I am. That's how I've achieved my dreams--because others helped me.

If I indulge in complaining I'll waste valuable time and energy that I'd rather devote to my writing. Maybe that extra time spent on my novels will give them the edge they need to be successful. It can't hurt.

For some reason I am thrilled and challenged that breaking into publishing is a hard road.

Does that make me bad?

Kabbu - delusional... hm... yes...

I have a plan. I say we writers join forces and take over the world! How could we possibly fail with all this untapped genius just waiting to be released??? Mm-mm-bra-ha-ha-ha-ha-ha-ha...(fade to eerie silence).

Oh. You asked a question, didn't you, Rachelle? Spend more time reading God's bestseller, get up a little earlier, drink a little more coffee, love more on my hubby and children. It all seems to result in a stronger will to write.
Becky

Kabbu - delusional... hm... yes...

I have a plan. I say we writers join forces and take over the world! How could we possibly fail with all this untapped genius just waiting to be released??? Mm-mm-bra-ha-ha-ha-ha-ha-ha...(fade to eerie silence).

Oh. You asked a question, didn't you, Rachelle? Spend more time reading God's bestseller, get up a little earlier, drink a little more coffee, love more on my hubby and children. It all seems to result in a stronger will to write.
Becky

Kabbu - delusional... hm... yes...

I have a plan. I say we writers join forces and take over the world! How could we possibly fail with all this untapped genius just waiting to be released??? Mm-mm-bra-ha-ha-ha-ha-ha-ha...(fade to eerie silence).

Oh. You asked a question, didn't you, Rachelle? Spend more time reading God's bestseller, get up a little earlier, drink a little more coffee, love more on my hubby and children. It all seems to result in a stronger will to write.
Becky

Every time I feel a bit frustrated, I add another mile to my running course. Last week, I logged 32 miles in five days! :-)

After reading a lot of the comments on the blog - and the constant kind of feedback I get from writers - it's amazing to me how many methods are being tried out there to get a book out to the public. While I commend every effort and there are always exceptions to success, I'm struck by how many are looking for shortcuts and wearing themselves out rather than asking more questions upfront about what's worked, what hasn't and what's a systematic approach to the business side of things. And, no matter how well you're articulating this very idea - even with guest bloggers who say, I banged my head against that wall, it's not a great choice - it's as if some can't hear you and go on to list the ways they're hitting the wall and their confusion about what's not working. Yes, I was one of them and I'm among the ranks now that can say it's a lot easier once I finally stopped my maneuvers and actually started to not just listen but take action on Rachelle's advice. My missing ingredients had been trust, faith and an inner knowledge I possessed the right stuff all along and didn't have anything to prove.

I stopped listening to all the people in writing and publishing who go on, and on, and on, about how hard it all is, how long it will take, blah, blah, blah.

Selling a book is a sales transaction. You just have to find the right customer. It's not about your emotions or your ego. It's business. No matter what you are selling you still have to find the right market for your product or service.

Sure you might write to satisfy internal urges, but when it's time to publish the work, it becomes a business transaction.

It sounds so terribly cliched to say, but if I don't keep trying, they it definitely doesn't happen. Besides, it's not worth it to listen to negativity, wherever you are in life. We're only here for so long. Just keep going!

I'll be back tomorrow (I should be in bed right now!) to check out some of those links. This is just craziness.

My hubby is a huge Mac guy (@godsmac on twitter) and has lots to say about the iPad and the future of publishing.

As a writer, I'm glad to have him and all his knowledge on my side. And, of course, my brilliant agent as well. ;)

I don't fly much, so I can't see the appeal in owning any kind of e-reader. I'm the kind of person who loves to hold something tangible in my hand (real pages you can actually turn!), and I rarely go through one book in a single trip, which is the only time I find it would be reasonable to have an e-reader. I do own an iPod, but I still use CDs in my car because the sound is better, and I find it much harder to find the CD I want spinning a stupid touch-dial. I don't see myself buying an e-reader anytime in the near future, but this whole story looks pretty scary from the P.O.V. of a fiction writer looking to break into the business.

Wow. Cutting edge technology takes on a new meaning.

I feel...overwhelmed. So important to have a REALLY good agent who understands these things in detail. I can get my head around it, but that just means I know there must be so many details I'm NOT aware of.

Very scary. And a little exciting!

I SO want an Ipad but not for $500.00! For that price it had better be coming to my house to do my dishes, cook my dinner and do the laundry.

A lot going on, but price is still a big obstacle and I want to own the things I buy - one of the reasons I won't lease a car.

Wow! The times, they are a changin'.

I will have an iPad in March (WiFi, not 3G because AT&T already bleeds me for enough every month without adding more to the pot), pending of course FCC approval.

I flat out think Amazon is being unreasonable. It was very passive-aggressive for them to dance along encouraging people to rise up against Macmillan. The flip side of response could've been to educate the public regarding the actual cost of publishing a book - that it is far more than pages and binding.

As a writer, it makes me nervous to think that people who are not part of the publishing industry feel compelled to devalue books because of format. As a reader, I am at the threshold of looking elsewhere for books (not Amazon) because of the antics over the past year and the blatant lack of customer service when there ARE problems. I've owned my Kindle 2 for just about a year now. For the past month, it has been nothing but glitches and bugs and has made the e-book experience unpleasant. I have a Kindle app on my iPhone. Tiny, and hard to read that way, but give me Apple tech and customer service any day of the week and twice on Sunday. They are simply phenomenal. No, I am not worried about investing in a first gen iPad. My first gen iPhone works great - as does my first gen iPod nano.

My favorite part is Amazon's spin that Macmillan "has a monopoly on their own titles." Of course they do. They're the publisher.

That's like saying General Mills has a monopoly on Wheaties, or George Lucas has a monopoly on Star Wars, or I have a monopoly on my children, or...

Another thoughtful post, Rachelle!

Do you want an iPad?
Not in the slightest. While I do have a Kindle and like the concept of the e-reader, the backlight on the iPad makes it completely not worth it for me. I'll admit, I'm not the biggest of Apple, in general. But, I also think they can do better than what they have with the iPad. For me, it's not functional. A laptop with a detachable, touch-screen monitor (like the Lenovo U1), I'd definitely go for.

What's your response to all these crazy happenings in publishing?
I think it's nice to shake things up once in a while. It keeps people and companies from getting too comfortable with the status quo. However, I tend to agree that ebooks are just another version of a book (i.e., akin to hardbacks vs mass market paperbacks) and that people will pay for for an ebook when it first comes out if they really want it. So, I was in complete disagreement with Amazon on their decision.

That being said, I think it's important to note that while they might have pulled sample chapters (that people didn't pay for), they did not remove paid for material. I checked my digital library. Does that mean I like that they can come in and remove things from my Kindle? No. And I do take issue from them removing the sample chapters. But, they didn't break any laws.

As both a writer and reader, I realize publishing is a business. Competitive pricing is good for the bookseller if it allows them to sell more books, which could be more lucrative for publishers and writers. However, there haven't been HUGE ebook sales so far, so I can see pubslishers' reluctance to have price ceilings incorporated into ebook pricing schemes. When it all plays out, it will be what the market will bear. At least, I hope so. :D

The iPad is getting close to being a device I have been wanting for a long time. I am not planning on getting the first generation though.

I have not read in depth into the Amazon and ebook issue. It will be interesting to see what Amazon does with the Kindle considering the entry price of the iPad. I never did buy a Kindle, though I wanted one, because the price is too high for a one-trick device.

I DID want an iPad (which is what it turned out disappointingly to be called) but not now.

I am a dedicated Mac user and have been for 20 years but the iPad
• cannot multitask
• has no USB port
• has no camera
• will not allow UK users access to the iBook store

So I will wait for 2nd or 3rd generation.

Do I want an iPad?

Possibly. The thing is, it doesn't fit into my life at the moment. No way I'd take that thing outside on my commute (I don't fancy getting mugged for displaying an outrageously expensive gadget with a very high resale value), and at home, I have my desktop computer, which has specs beyond the iPad.

I own an e-reader (which I use on the commute) and an iPhone, and I don't see how the iPad would make a huge contribution to my life. Before I got the e-reader, I was happy to read short novels on my iPhone.

So, very shiny, very beautiful, I'm thrilled with the idea/concept, but I don't need it and I don't have that kind of money burnign a hole in my pocket.

Big move, though, for the e-publishing industry, so no doubt this gadget will have a major impact.

How do I feel? I feel....thankful you're my agent. Yikes!

I would like an iPad, or just a Kindle at this point. I still like my books, though.

Another article on e-reading/Amazon in the FT. http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/b682c02c-0eae-11df-bd79-00144feabdc0.html

The iPad has too many bells and whistles for someone looking for an eReader. I have a laptop and an iPhone, so I feel like an iPad (at $500) would be an expensive redundancy -- at least right now, fo me.

As a recently reformed, non-practicing musician (Writing is better. Trust me!) I watched as the music industry rode the DRM rollercoaster a few years ago. Apple and others tried to make DRM stick. Now, most music you buy off I-Tunes and alot of other Mp3 sites is DRM-free. DRM didn't work. People want to own what they buy, not just rent it.

So in the next year, I expect we'll see a similar stampede toward DRM by the e-book reader companies, followed by an equally precipitous stampede away from DRM when they figure out the market won't support it.

Meanwhile, I'll be reading my under-$5 used paperbacks and shiny new hardcovers from the ole Brink and Mortar, happy as a clam.

Hi Rachelle, Thanks for the informative post. As many others have stated, I'm glad I have a "great" agent who is so on top of the publishing business. ;)

That said, although I checked out the IPad info, it's not something I'll be spending money on. I have a Sony e-reader (received as a gift) and have even loaded a few "classic" books on it for free, but have yet to open it up for reading.

At least with a old-fashioned book I can give it away or pass it on to a friend if I want to. It's a great way to share a new author or good writing to others. ;)

In fact, I'm hoping they'll eventually introduce a smaller one that will fit into my handbag...

They already have one...it's called an iPhone. :)

I own a Mac and an iPhone and so obviously I'm not averse to Apple products, but I think this release is going to prove to be more hype than substance. I believe that any advances made in this release will eventually be merged into the iPhone anyway. I've studied the iPad a little and I just don't see what it offers that my 3G doesn't.

Actually I just checked and even the iPad's OS is based on the iPhone's. I would have thought they'd at least have made a special stripped down version of OSX...

A few things:

One, Shop Barnes and Noble. The books are on their website.

Two, buy real books with covers and spines and pages you can touch. It's yours to do whatever. The publisher or seller is not going to come to your house and retrieve the book back for their own purposes because of a contract dispute. It really is your book.

No I don't want an Ipad. No I don't want digital books.

No I'm not deterred from writing. No I'm not scared. No I don't appreciate Amazon tactics. No I don't appreciate a lot of things.. however ...

I know what I like. Reading a good story and striving to write a better story.

With a spine and a cover and real pages to touch and stack on my bedside table .. and it won't be affected by lack of batteries or digitization of a contract dispute.

Real books. They always work.

I promise not to follow this up with a diatribe about the black helicopters. But it flat-out terrifies me that we could move to a media format in which we don't have the right to retain the media. Amazon yanking books over a financial dispute only paves the way for books to be pulled for other reasons. Sorry to go all Farenheit 451, but this truly does concern me. Remember when Amazon filed all LGBT material as "adult content" and really mucked that up? Way too much power in the hands of just a few in the world of e-books right now.

It also begins to make more sense why Amazon insists on only charging $9.99. As a consumer, if I'm only paying for access (for an apparently undertermined time--but in the future will e-book access through Amazon expire after a year? six months?) rather than a tangible product or a my own digital file, you better believe I don't want to pay more than ten bucks. In fact, even that sounds like a rip-off if my rights to the book "expire" before I have a chance to finish it!

I'm sticking with the library and my local bookstore for now. (Plus, they have cats at my local bookstore. Amazon and Apple cannot offer free entertainment in the form of bookstore cats.)

I am curious to see the exact size of it. It looks about as big as the Macbook I'm working on at the moment. I've been really happy with my ipod touch and love the fact that I can stick in my purse and whip it out for reading the books I've downloaded (I should probably check to see that they're still there), checking email whatever - of course I have to be someplace where I can get a wireless signal so it's not like a Blackberry, but I don't want anything bigger. I'm not convinced of the greatness of the iPad yet.

Rachelle: Thank you so much for putting this all together. I'm sending my clients your way, er, to get a grasp on this digital war.
Betsy

Apple people are so self absorbed...it's all i, i, i. *grin*

Watching the Grammy's last night one of the folks made a big plug for BUYING your music downloads, and asked how you would like it to not receive payment for your lifes work. Same issue coming for authors. And how many movies are pirated, or copied illigally and passed on?

I'm not planning on buying an ipad anytime soon, but no doubt when my 5th grader enters high school, she'll have it or the next big thing. I remember having to dial a rotary phone attached to the wall, and my kids won't even have to use pencil or paper.

Thanks for doing these posts, it allows me to pass on info to my writer's group so our expectations are more...realistic. :)

The iPad (giggle!): Frankly, I live in a family full of geeks (okay fine, I am a geek too), and the general consensus is that the iPad is a redundant, weak, poorly named let-down. There was so much more it could have been to actually be awesome (like, you know, a computer instead of a glorified iTouch), and a lot of us techies are not impressed enough to splurge $500 we don't have on a 1st gen piece of shiny technology that's so redundant.

As far as publishing goes, I can understand all the upheaval. From a laywoman's perspective, it seems books are headed the way of music, where for x amount of money, a relatively unknown like me can get an album published on itunes and start making direct profits. 20 years ago, there's no way you could have succeeded in any degree without an agent-and frankly if you really want to hit it big, you still need one. Still, when you look at what iTunes has done to an already saturated industry, it's interesting. Frustrating on the one hand because you'll never hear some potentially great artists, and amazing on the other because there are some people producing accessible music who might never have made the radio cut.
So I'm watching what's happening and wondering if in time similar things won't start happening with books. Which will mean, I think, that the circle of authors who can make a living off of writing will shrink even further.

But, I'll think about that tomorrow. ;)

So far I am still happy with my Kindle. Of course I still read paper books when I can and save the Kindle for when I travel.

But don't we live in an exciting world? Constant culture shock.

I haven't joined the age of digital readers yet... I like paper, although I know I'll eventually succumb (but I'll still like my paper...)

My response? I think as an unpublished author, it's good to keep an ear open, but not dwell on it. My job is to keep writing and get better at it... it's the whole concept of change what you can, accept and adapt to what you can't.
Obviously, a publishers/agents response should be much different than mine.

A reader? As long as you keep printing books for me to buy, I don't really care.

A writer? I think it's too early to really tell...

I don't want an iPad. I'm happy with my SONY e-reader--as a supplement to reading printed books--not a substitute. It's simple and easy to use and doesn't overwhelm me with fancy stuff. I couldn't afford an iPad anyway, even if the price goes down.

All this publishing stuff is scary because it's changing so fast. I walked into my beloved local bookstore over the weekend where I spend A LOT of time and was confronted with going-out-of-business signs. Now that really makes me sad.

Well, I hate it. I am a paper girl, through and through and I hate change. I know, I sound like someone in the 80's who didn't want to give up her LPs, but seriously, not everything has to go digital.

I know I've seen too many movies, but I feel like if everything in our lives is switched over to some form of digital media those are just more and ways for "big brother" (or whoever) to hack in and invade privacy.

Besides. I want to smell my books. And love the font. And marvel at how it falls open at the halfway mark. I spend enough time in front of the computer...I truly believe it's impossible to "curl up with a good computer."

But then, I'm kinda crabby today so take that with a grain of salt.

(Did I even answer the question you asked?)

Let's be honest here. I usually want just about everything that has an "i" in front of it!

Wow. I can't wait to read up on this! This is mind boggling.

Right now I feel that an ipad is too expensive and the battery life is ridiculous. It wouldn't last on an overseas flight and then it would just be another thing to steal. A few years from now, with an extended battery life, more tricks, and a better price, I'd definitely consider it if I had the money!

Macmillan has a "monopoly" on their books? And I guess Apple has a "monopoly" on the iPad? THOSE EVIL MOTHERLESS CORPORATIONS!

Just like Amazon having a "monopoly" on the Kindle. Oh, wait...

(IDIOTS.)

I think your point on writing good books is right on track and that remians my main focus. Todays technology will be old news tomorrow. Writers need to be aware of what is transpiring and these blogs are a great way to keep up to date.

I would not own and e-reader until there is a solid text-to-speech format perfected, then I'm in.

also: I admit that I tend to "try" author's on my kindle- and if I love the book, I buy the print, and sometimes audio as well. I doubt I am the only multi- format buyer, out there.

thus- E-readers have actually increased my spending on good books. ;)

I may be showing my ignorance here, but I have a question about the digital rights issue. Does this mean that if you buy an e-book for your Kindle, you can't use it on any other reading device (or iPad) you decide to switch or upgrade to? If that's the case, I'm not sure I'd ever want to buy an e-book.

I haven't jumped into the digital reader world yet. I prefer to let the dust settle on new technology so the VHS/Beta-HD/Blu-Ray issues are hammered out. I don't want to be left holding a Sony Reader if the world runs on Kindle, etc.

I'm so thankful I don't have to navigate these waters alone. :)

Good morning, Rachelle;

What happened to our ordinary days? Upheaval seems to be the name of the game.

iPad? No, thank you. I love the color touch screen and some of the bells and whistles. But the virtual keyboard? It's an ergonomic nightmare. Laid flat to type, it will encourage back pain. Tilting it up at an angle to solve that problem could cause wrist pain. And where's the handle? I have small hands and drop things often. Getting a good grip on an iPad would be impossible for me.

My response? I'm an interested spectator with no control over any of it. In my opinion, this is similar to clothing manufacturers putting a "suggested retail price" on a suit that Macy then puts on sale. The manufacturer loses control of the price of the garment when they sell it to Macy. Do they get angry when Macy puts the garment on the 75% off rack? Does it matter? Macy bought the suit. If Amazon buys the book file, then they have a right to sell it at whatever price they desire.

Q4McMillion: How angry do you get with buyers and sellers of remainder books when they don't sell for the full cover price? How are you protecting authors and agents then?

This is a highly complex business world. It's all about power and money and protecting your turf no matter where you sit at the table. I try to keep that in mind when I see all the high drama.

Thanks for the conversation, Rachelle.

Be blessed,

Lynnda

Someone at church yesterday described the iPad as a big iPhone. I think Apple has an uphill battle. Well produced videos aside, I think most people will either see the iPad as something like an iPhone that is too big or something like a laptop that isn't powerful enough.

I love how the video says that the keyboard is almost as big as a laptop keyboard even as it was clear that the person using it on the video was struggling a little. I've got big hands, I don't think "almost" is going to cut it.

As for books, I wouldn't rule Amazon.com out just yet. If the iPad become too competitive with the Kindle, I suspect it wouldn't be too hard for them to allow people to purchase books from them and read them on the iPad. It is, after all, just a web browser.